Breaststroke questions

What would be a typical, normal stroke rate (strokes per minute) for a novice breaststroker who's just interested in getting to the other end of the pool, not racing, to aim for? Novice level, please, NOT some world record race pace. not sure, maybe one every 2 or 3 seconds, do more gliding after each kick Also, I read a lot about "driving" or "moving" one's hips forward during the stroke. Is that the same motion and using the same muscles as doing a stomach crunch (although upside-down), or is it something else? Why is it done, in which part of the stroke is it done, and when is it undone? Which variants (flat, wave, recreational) is it for? driving hips might be referring to when you're doing the insweep & thrust and setting up the kick The Breastroke Lane has a ton of info forums.usms.org/showthread.php

Ande is right about the timing of the hip thrust.It is really the opposite of a crunch,you push the hips forward.don't push them very far,maybe 1 1/2 inches at the most.You undo this,and a little more, bending very slightly forward at the hips, as you shoot your arms forward on the recovery. The purpose of the hip thrust is to set up that forward thrust to get your hips to the surface so that you can get a little bit of thrust from the undulation,somewhat like a dolphin kick,and be in a streamlined position to glide after the kick.This is done in the wave style breaststroke.How fast you stroke depends on many factors,but central would be the power of your kick.The better your kick the further you can "ride the glide"after each kick before you slow down.With a good kick you can take a stroke every 3 seconds and make good time,with a bad kick you probably need to do about a stroke per second.

Swim Faster Faster (SFF) Tip 386 Common Breaststroke Mistakes shares many excellent breastroke concepts Read em & Reap

So Ande suggests 2-3 seconds (20-30 strokes/minute) and Allen suggests 1-3 seconds (20-60 strokes/minute), and the swimmer can control it by varying the duration of the glide phase and/or moving the arms and legs (and head and hips and whatever else) faster or slower during the non-glide phases. That's a lot of experimentation to do, but that's a fun part of swimming! Would I be right if I said that "moving the hips backward" (what goes forward must go backward for a periodic motion such as a swimming stroke) would be equivalent to hollowing the lower back, or, if standing, sticking the butt out? Alan

Agree. The anology is kick a needle (needle being your arms), pull a needle (needle being your legs). You want to prolong the leg recovery as long as possible through the insweep and recover the legs at the time of the shoot. Doing this minimizes the amount of time you are not streamlined. Well said,I like that imagery.

Agree. The anology is kick a needle (needle being your arms), pull a needle (needle being your legs). You want to prolong the leg recovery as long as possible through the insweep and recover the legs at the time of the shoot. Doing this minimizes the amount of time you are not streamlined. Excellent image!

Agree. The anology is kick a needle (needle being your arms), pull a needle (needle being your legs). You want to prolong the leg recovery as long as possible through the insweep and recover the legs at the time of the shoot. Doing this minimizes the amount of time you are not streamlined.

Regarding driving the hips forward: I found this at www.goswim.tv/.../breaststroke-101.html : "Drawing the hips forward means keeping the legs together and extended as you initiate the insweep part of your pull. If you keep the legs extended as you initiate the insweep, you should get the feeling that you're pulling your hips forward. It means that you're waiting till the last moment to separate the legs, bend the knees, and get your legs ready to deliver the kick." "You should get the feeling"? So it's an illusion, hips aren't actually going forward? Alan

With regard to the arms, it's a needle figuratively, not literally. I would encourage a shoot with seperation of the hands palms down. This will allow getting the thumbs down quicker for the outsweep.

Ever since a velocity evaluation in 2010 I have been working on a narrower pull that doesn't emphasize the outsweep.The study showed I slowed down at the initiation of the outsweep.I now have my thumbs very nearly level with the rest of my hands,trying to get into a position very much like EVF except the hands are a little outside of the elbows.The action is much more pullback than outsweep/insweep.I think I am faster with less effort this way.I still have some insweep at the transition from pull to recovery and recover with my hands touching to be more needle like to help "ride the glide.