Speed Zone

BN, I think Chris nailed it in his replies (it kills me to admit that :))! And in response to your coaches training philosophy, there are certainly different paths that can lead to the same/similar result, you just will never know unless your willing to experiment/try! Also, send me a PM and let me know which club you are talking about...I've got an idea but it sounds like a lot of the clubs I've seen.

Thanks Chris for such a well thought out reply. I really appreciate it and it makes a lot of sense. Will mull this over. And yes, with the few quality sets I have done, I agree, it's NOT a recovery day. I find it rather painful. And that's part of the issue - it's certainly not fun yet. :) During my 8x50 fly set on 2:00 (not enough rest still, I know), I commented that it really hurt BAD! And my coach responded, "Just like the last lap of your 100 fly race, eh?" Uh no. My 100 fly in a meet never hurts like that. At all. I think that's a sign.

Will someone please give me directions for vertical kicking. Where are your arms? What kick should i use? How long shuld I do it for? How many times per week. Should I do it at the beginning or the end of practice? thanks ahead of time!! :)

Will someone please give me directions for vertical kicking. Where are your arms? What kick should i use? How long shuld I do it for? How many times per week. Should I do it at the beginning or the end of practice? thanks ahead of time!! :) You can put your arms over your head holding a weight or at your side or just you hands out of the water or alternate all of the above. Try them all. You can kick all out for 10 sec and rest for 20. repeat 8 times and you will be tired! You can kick easy during recovery between sets. Some times I'll do vert kicking in the dive well when there are no open lanes. Anyway there is no right or wrong way, it's whatever you want to make of it.

Paul, I spoke w/ my coach about adding in these types of sets or workouts to my schedule and was told that some are big believers in this type of training but that's not how they train where I swim. BN, if I might offer a suggestion...? Obviously you're happy with your training and like your club, and that's great. Many -- maybe even most? -- people don't have such a nice situation so you don't want to look a gift horse in the mouth. But what you could do is do a quality workout on your own at regular intervals (say, once a week). It isn't ideal, of course: it is always easier to have a coach standing over you with a stopwatch, to motivate you to swim fast. Swimming with others is good too, and one of the nice things about having a coach you trust is that you don't have to waste mental energy worrying about what to do. But effective quality solo workouts can definitely be done, especially if you only do them once a week. Look at Fortress as an example. So you could pick up some of Paul's workouts, modify as needed, and do it on your own. The main thing is (a) swim FAST with (b) lots of recovery time. If you can find a motivated training partner to do it with, that would be even better. The (very successful) age-group team here probably trains similarly to yours: somewhat old-school, lots of sets with short rest (though they definitely get up on the blocks from time to time). But they've also begun what they call "specialty training" which is basically a rotating group that works with Mark Kutz (our masters coach) on quality, race-pace training. The AG coaches will send different swimmers to Mark for part of the workout, and then they return to complete the normal workout. They only send the swimmers who have good attendance and have earned it by working hard in the "regular" practices. Kids go there maybe once a week and learn about race-pace training and pacing, with lots of rest. Some (the sprinters) also do speedwork. And everyone also does fast kicking (Mark maintains a board with the names of the fastest kickers, and their times in a 50 all-out kick). Anyway, the program is very popular with the kids and it seems to work well, based on results. And it fits in with their normal, hard-core training. So maybe you can reproduce something like that: do the bulk of your training as you do now, but do some quality work too. (Just don't think of them as recovery days from high-yardage days: you might do less yardage, but they aren't recovery. At least not if you do them properly.) Good luck.

Thanks again Chris and Paul. Chris, I purposely did not select a first set of 100s or 200s b/c I'm very aware of how much that will hurt. I need to build up gradually to pain. With the 8x50s they were supposed to be all out. If we do 200 race pace (that same set), we'll do them on 1:00 and often 1 EZ / 1 FAST (not 2:00). I was thinking all out 100% should have been on 3:00 perhaps? And yeah, I don't want to think about 200s yet. Although to the coaches' credit we do always end the practice with a 200 or a few 100s or 50s fast for time. I don't know if that counts for speed work. I would guess not b/c we usually have done anywhere from 5,000 to 8,500 yards by then. Although this year, I'm nailing out some faster swims (as compared to when I first started this.) And no, I don't do that much yardage every day. In fact, I swim LESS than when I swam masters b/c I alternate days on and days off. Tomorrow, I don't plan on doing more than 3K. Max. Paul, I'll PM you. Appreciate it!

Chris...as much as I would like to someday be seen as a "coach"...in my book that title is reserved for the Frank Bush's, Eddie Reese's & Kerry Obrien's of the swimming world. But...as you know to well I do have opinions! :) So, piggybacking on your post....which I agree and like your definitions...the only thing I would add is "speed assistance" work that truly allows one to "feel" what race pace and beyond race pace feels like. Examples would be reverse bungee work where the swimmer is pulled vs. pulling the cord, use of fins and wearing tech suits in workout...also running/dive into turn work where you take a few short strides on the deck, dive in the pool, take a few quick strokes and hit your turn at/above race pace.

Chris, I purposely did not select a first set of 100s or 200s b/c I'm very aware of how much that will hurt. I need to build up gradually to pain. With the 8x50s they were supposed to be all out. If we do 200 race pace (that same set), we'll do them on 1:00 and often 1 EZ / 1 FAST (not 2:00). I was thinking all out 100% should have been on 3:00 perhaps? And yeah, I don't want to think about 200s yet. Although to the coaches' credit we do always end the practice with a 200 or a few 100s or 50s fast for time. I don't know if that counts for speed work. I would guess not b/c we usually have done anywhere from 5,000 to 8,500 yards by then. So part of the issue is that the following terms often get confused or are used interchangeably to mean "quality training." There is overlap, of course, but there are some differences. Speed work. I view this is very short (mostly 15s and 25s; sometimes 50s) with lots of rest. This is almost as much about technique (breakouts, turns, starts, turnover) as about physiological training. However, there is an energy system (I forget the name) that is specifically stressed with this kind of work. In speed work, lactate levels should not rise very high. It is tiring, but not really that painful. I don't do enough of this because I dislike it. But if you want to be fast in the 50s, you need to do this. Lactate Tolerance. This is basically any set where your lactate levels spike high; in other words, they hurt the most. You are training your body to buffer the acid and clear out the lactate. There are lots of ways to do this kind of set. You need to have enough rest to be able to push it hard, but it doesn't have to be a huge amount. We do a lot of training (maybe too often) of this type. Some examples of "test sets" we do: 10 x 100 on 2:00 from a push, hold best average 5 x 100 on 4:00 off the blocks, hold best average 5 x 200 on 7:00 off the blocks, hold best average Our coach also loves sets like the following; we'll do 2-3 cycles through, often at the end of practice. 200 strong + 50 easy on 4:00 200 broken on 4:15, done as: 150 strong, rest 10 sec, 50 fast (at race pace). Add up time should be faster than #1. Then do an easy 50. 200 broken on 4:30, done as: 2 x 100, rest 10 sec between, faster add-up than #2, then 50 easy 200 broken, done as 4 x 50 with 10 sec rest, fastest add-up, 50 easy 1-2 min rest before next cycle. The more rest you get, the closer to race pace you should be able to go. But that doesn't necessarily mean you are producing more lactate, or training your body to handle it any better. But there are additional advantages to race-pace training. You have to be careful with lactate sets. If you do them too often, you'll overtrain and regress. Race pace training This is actually a specialized form of lactate tolerance, where you get enough rest to hit your goal race pace. You should know what your race pace is for all your races: last 50 of your goal 100, last 3 50s of your goal 200, that sort of thing. Besides all the advantages of lactate tolerance, swimming at race pace has additional advantages: -- you learn what the pace feels like, the relationship between perceived effort and speed. This is huge, IMO, especially for 200s and longer, where you have to control yourself going out. -- you learn the proper technique for race pace strokes and turns. Stroke mechanics, breakouts, underwaters: all those things can change in a race compared to practice (where you are usually swimming slower). You want to make sure that you find and correct problems in practice, BEFORE the race. Broken sets are a traditional way to do this. But whatever you do, it has to be shorter than the race, obviously: you can't expect to do season-ending times in practice during the season (if you can, then you need to revise your goals). There are other types of "quality work" you can do. Sometimes I'll work on power -- not quite the same as speedwork -- by using a parachute; others use stretch cords. Doing weights also works on power, of course, but it is nice to do something in the water to make sure that any power/strength you gain in the gym can be applied in the water. This isn't really "quality," but I also like doing longer pull sets where my HR doesn't necessary get too high; this is more for what I would call "aerobic power," training my slow-twitch muscles to have some power/endurance. You probably do stuff like that a lot. I recommend reading Maglischo's book, it is a little dry but also has a lot of good concepts. As with anything (including this), take it with a grain of salt and combine it with your own experience for the best guide. Paul is a real coach (I am not) and probably has more good things to add. Have fun!

...also running/dive into turn work where you take a few short strides on the deck, dive in the pool, take a few quick strokes and hit your turn at/above race pace. I think I injured myself just by READING about that. :)

...also running/dive into turn work where you take a few short strides on the deck, dive in the pool, take a few quick strokes and hit your turn at/above race pace. I think I injured myself just by READING about that. :) You can see it demonstrated here at about the 3:10 mark. I'm guessing the lifeguards at many pools will have some issues with this, but fortunately my group is self-guarded, so I'm free to tempt fate and try it. Perhaps I will. www.floswimming.org/.../7428-practice-at-the-race-club