The new reality

Almost everybody on this board, including you, lectures! It may only *seem* like a lecture when you don't agree with the poster... Possibly true. But it sometimes seems like those who liked the suits, aka the "cheaters," are in a special subclass for persecution. And I won't agree with posters who suggest I need to train harder. :D Even though suit opponents are vocal here and at convention, I still think that the suit ban is/will be a contributing factor in lower meet attendance this year. I don't think it's all the economy, a factor which has existed for some time now.

Possibly true. But it sometimes seems like those who liked the suits, aka the "cheaters," are in a special subclass for persecution. And I won't agree with posters who suggest I need to train harder. :D Even though suit opponents are vocal here and at convention, I still think that the suit ban is/will be a contributing factor in lower meet attendance this year. I don't think it's all the economy, a factor which has existed for some time now. I can see how you feel that way, being on the losing end of the debate (for now, at least). Training harder only helps so much, and we can all only train as much as we have time or desire for. The suits made people faster regardless of how much they trained, and it was definitely fun to swim faster regardless of the reasons why it happened. If attendance is down, it'll be hard to isolate the causes for sure. Maybe some people stay away because they can't use the suits. But I believe a lot of people were intimidated about competing by people wearing the suits too. Maybe bringing more of those folks into the fold will offset the former tech suit wearers who refuse to compete. I still find swimming fun and worthwile despite my non-techsuit performance "setbacks". I know you do too. To me, that's what this sport is all about. Nice chatting with you. Now I will go back into message board hibernation for a month or two!

If attendance is down, it'll be hard to isolate the causes for sure. Maybe some people stay away because they can't use the suits. But I believe a lot of people were intimidated about competing by people wearing the suits too. Maybe bringing more of those folks into the fold will offset the former tech suit wearers who refuse to compete. Nice chatting with you. Now I will go back into message board hibernation for a month or two! hahaha As far as I can glean, it appears to be easier to lose existing competitors than to recruit new ones right now. Though I guess based on anecdotal evidence it's hard to rule out the intimidation factor. I'm not sure "refuse" to compete is quite the right word. I suspect it will be more a matter of not swimming as many meets or not swimming as many events.

My 2010 times are much slower than my 2009 times, some of it is how I trained this summer and fall (didn't lift weights) but much of it is the suit, racing in new blue 70 full body versus a textile jammer. Female swimmers still have a significant amount of coverage, their times would be more effected if they were required to wear a bikini or jammer bottoms & a sports bra like top, exposing the mid sections. Even though textile isn't as fast as rubber coated textile, the current legal suits for females provide a great deal of compression and a way better hull surface than bare flesh. Swimmers are swimming very fast in just textile. Lean young firm swimmers aren't as effected as flabbier older not as firm swimmers. Loose skin or skin on the loose creates more drag. At the 2010 Ron Johnston SCM Meet, Jeff Commings swam very fast in just a jammer, his 2010 times were fairly close to his 2009 times. Though his SCM 2:09 200 IM in 2010 was 2 seconds slower than his 2:07 in 2009 It is possible for masters to swim faster in textile suits than they did in rubber suits but for many it will take some serious preparation. here's a few of my time comparisons event / 2009 / 2010 100 IM / 1:00.15 / 1:03.5 200 IM / 2:11.28 / 2:16.26 100 FL / 0:58.0 / 0:61.9 050 BK / 0:27.4 / 0:28.8 I'm training for a meet in 2 weeks to see if I can improve my 2010 times, but right now it ain't pretty. Ande Agree! I have Alzheimers about my college times. Gull is correct. The suits definitely make a difference. Exactly how much is still unclear to me, though Gull's estimate for free seem quite reasonable. I think the difference may depend, in part, on body type, size, age, stroke and conditioning. Since the ban, in SCM and LCM, I've done a couple personal worsts and had some big gaps even in 50s (1.5 seconds off previous tapered times). But in the two meets in question I was either coming off the flu or having taken time off training, so they were not apples to apples comparisons. And I can't seem to do evilstroke at all anymore. I only have two fairly straight up comparisons in yards in the 50s. At Zones last April, I swam 2 50 frees, one in a B70 and one in a kneeskin. .4 difference. At this year's Sprint Classic (compared to last year), I was .2 slower in the 50 fly, but .4 faster in the 50 back in a kneeskin. My 50 back kneeskin time was actually faster than my time in a Jaked from Atlanta. But that may just have been due to better execution. I have CZ/NE Champs in a few weeks, so I will have a better sense there. I'm hoping to keep the differential under 1 second for the 50s in SCM. I fear the gaps in the 100s will be much vaster than the 50s though ... I maintain my previous stance of absolutely hating kneeskins. I don't think they seem any easier to get on either.

Female swimmers still have a significant amount of coverage, their times would be more effected if they were required to wear a bikini or jammer bottoms & a sports bra like top, exposing the mid sections. I think men need to get over this and move on. Perhaps I should say "man up" or would that be hypocritical? Women have never competed in bikinis and men have almost always competed in briefs and jammers. Nor do I think (with the exception of the younger age groups possibly) that this would do anything to increase USMS membership. Plus, except for men with moobs, woman are more effected by the lack of zippers because of the girls. And women typically have more body fat than men.

Women have never competed in bikinis...Nor do I think (with the exception of the younger age groups possibly) that this would do anything to increase USMS membership. Maybe this is the time for me to ask if anyone else enjoyed the cover of the latest issue of SWIMMER? I know I did.

Maybe this is the time for me to ask if anyone else enjoyed the cover of the latest issue of SWIMMER? I know I did. This might prompt a spat of postings on the topic of who has received their Swimmer magazine ... Are we going the way of Runners magazine? That would be good, along with a USMS hottie calendar. But I have a suspicion that what you see at most masters meets is somewhat different. YMMV.

But I have a suspicion that what you see at most masters meets is somewhat different. YMMV. True, but there's usually some eye candy. And not all in the 18-24 age group, either.

It's unfortunate you made the decision to not maximize your training by making the minuscule investment in a legal and fast suit in Atlanta. Unfortunate to who? Not to me. I wanted an apples to apples comparison to see how much I had improved. Changing suits would have not given me an accurate assessment. Besides, if you check out my times under "Elaine Krugman" and see where I am ranked, you will understand why I feel the way I do. I'm not exactly Top 10 material!

I banned myself from wearing tech suits a year early- I went through this last year. I swam 2009 SCY nats in a LZR and 2010 SCY nats in a jammer. Both meets were shave and taper meets, and I feel I was more or less in the same condition. I'm 40 years old, 6'0", 175lb with a shoulder-driven stroke. Not too muscular, slightly puffy: 50 free was ~0.5sec slower w/jammer 100 free was ~1.5sec slower w/jammer 200 free was ~3sec slower w/jammer