Thank you in advance for your advice. My son has joined the Air Force, though he has not gone to Basic yet. He was approved for a very challenging career known as a TACP (Please see Link - www.globalsecurity.org/.../tacp.htm )
One of the criteria for getting into this particular specialty was to pass the NON-SWIMMING portions of the PAST (Physical Ability Stamina Test - www.afsoc.af.mil/.../pastcriteria.asp ). He was approached today and told that an even more critical need for the USAF was for Combat Controllers, but he would need to also pass the 2 swimming portions of the PAST (see link above, please). Now, he's in great shape, and he can swim like a regular person can swim, but he's NEVER been a swimmer, per se. The question I have is, what should he do in order to prepare to pass the 2 swimming tests:
1) 2 x 20 Meter Underwater Swim: Provide the member 3-minutes of rest between underwaters. If members surface or break the water surface during any portion of the swim, the test will be stopped and considered a failure.
2) 500 Meter Surface Swim (max. time limit 14 minutes for CCT/SOWT; max. time limit 11 minutes 30 seconds for PJ): This swim is conducted using the freestyle, breaststroke or sidestroke. The swim is continuous (non-stop). If a member stops any time during the swim, the test will be stopped and considered a failure for the entire PAST.
Sorry for the long message. Any advice will be greatly appreciated.
if he will be required to:
+ swim 50 yards underwater &
+ work up to 4000 yards
then he should train more often to get in shape for those challenges
like 5 to 6 times a week
He should get to where he can pass the tests on his worst day in practice
Anytime when practicing underwater swimming and breathholding, there should be somebody around supervising in case he blacks out. I've seen it happen before.
Being confident and being relaxed will improve time and distance underwater.
Swimming completely underwater also depends on having neutral or negative buoyancy. Fat people can have trouble staying below the surface. :)
Okay, time for dumb questions. Why does a "controller" need to know how to swim or swim underwater? Just curious...not like he is going to be a Navy Seal or something equivalent in the Air Force. Dang, that movie "An Officer and a Gentleman" was good, I watch it every now and then on late night TV. The underwater thing is training your mind, not your body. Your C02 build up will tell you to breathe, you shouldn't obey it. Eventually you would run out of air also, but not within the 50 yards realm. Takes a little longer. But most deaths in apnea training are in shallow pools with the swimmer alone. billy fanstone
Thank you all for your extremely helpful and considered responses. I've forwarded all of them to my son, who offers his sincere gratitude to you fine people.
Just a note. I neglected to mention that he's already passed all of the other elements of the PAST. Of course, he can't take just the swimming portions of it by themselves so he'd have to repeat the running, calisthenics, etc., but he's been working to get himself in shape to do those things, and you have, collectively, given him sufficient information to proceed with his preparations for the full PAST should he decide to pursue it.
Thank you all very much!
Jay
Underwater modified breaststroke, let's call it that. Full-length pulls, with dolphin kick during the pull, like you are allowed to do during a breaststroke pull-out. After the pull and a bit of glide phase, do a frog kick and recover the arms to the front streamlined position. Repeat until you cover the distance to pass the test, or until you must surface to breathe, whichever comes first. I have found this to be the fastest way to swim submerged, when swimming for distance alone without any regard to rules. The dolphin kick helps tremendously.
Here you go, Do it like she does in this video, except do not surface until you reach the required distance, or need to breathe. This is a good video because it shows how much the dolphin kick simultaneous with the pull helps out.
YouTube- Underwater breaststroke start
Okay, time for dumb questions. Why does a "controller" need to know how to swim or swim underwater? Just curious...not like he is going to be a Navy Seal or something equivalent in the Air Force. Dang, that movie "An Officer and a Gentleman" was good, I watch it every now and then on late night TV. The underwater thing is training your mind, not your body. Your C02 build up will tell you to breathe, you shouldn't obey it. Eventually you would run out of air also, but not within the 50 yards realm. Takes a little longer. But most deaths in apnea training are in shallow pools with the swimmer alone. billy fanstone
Mr. Fanstone,
Controllers have to swim because at anytime in their career they can be assigned to support Army or Navy units that have a mission requiring them to be proficient and comfortable in the water. Controllers, as part of their normal technical school pipeline, go through the Army's Special Forces Scuba course, the Air Force's underwater egress (yuck), and any other water confidence course required.
In general, TACPs are not assigned to these types of units, thus they don't have to go through such training.
And as far as that movie you referrenced is concerned, there are better movies out there. Just search the internet for PJ Indoc course videos. ;)
Mr. Tyson (call me billy), I agree with the basic survival course and so forth given in all armed forces of the world. As a basic training and making you over all fit and getting you ready for a crash into jungle or sea, whatever. I just was wondering about the specifics once you get out of basic training and start specialization. Am I missing something or aren't these controllers, just "controllers". I mean, okay, you might have an advanced tower in jungle or bad conditions, but water? Here is my theory: you might lose some good material by eliminating some good prospects by a physical test which will not be needed in their function later on. Sorry to argue this longer, I have many friends in all areas of the Brazilian Air Force, including controllers, just curious. billy fanstone
P.S. The guy next to me in my avatar is the one and only Chuck Yeager, at a Sun and Fun in Florida sometime around 1996.
No problem, Billy (call me Mike). The difference between these controllers and "just" controllers is the word that is right before it. Combat.
These guys control aircraft in combat conditions.
Mr. Tyson (call me billy), I agree with the basic survival course and so forth given in all armed forces of the world. As a basic training and making you over all fit and getting you ready for a crash into jungle or sea, whatever. I just was wondering about the specifics once you get out of basic training and start specialization. Am I missing something or aren't these controllers, just "controllers". I mean, okay, you might have an advanced tower in jungle or bad conditions, but water? Here is my theory: you might lose some good material by eliminating some good prospects by a physical test which will not be needed in their function later on. Sorry to argue this longer, I have many friends in all areas of the Brazilian Air Force, including controllers, just curious. billy fanstone
P.S. The guy next to me in my avatar is the one and only Chuck Yeager, at a Sun and Fun in Florida sometime around 1996.
Okay, combat duty, eventually. But still, they have their tower, or at least their radio equipment, but water? Once you have gotten into inadvertent conditions you are not a controller any more, you are a soldier trying to keep alive. Thus the question about the pre-requisite, unless this is a requisite for all Air Force personnel. My fine print question is not about over all being fit and ready for whatever duty, combat duty for a specific area of expertise, it is about the physical requisite for a non physical job, such as controller, or pilot. A friend of mine was adamant and curious about the physical capability of women as fighter pilots. It took me a lot of explaining to prove to him that it was not physical strength that was necessary to fly a fighter but other capabilities that would be slowly demanded and cause one to fail or succeed, including men and women. The ability to support g-forces, the manual abilities and other abilities in flying a fighter were not gender oriented. Thanks for your patience, billy fanstone
