Butterfly, Breathing Every Stroke

I wonder if breathing to the side will help keep your body in better position?

I am still trying to figure this out. I tend to breathe every stroke on the fly leg on my 400 IM(went out at 1:08 at Indy). In the 200 fly, I tend to breathe every stroke for the first 100, attempt to breathe 3 stroke, then skip a breathe on the third 50 and breathe every stroke on the last 50 but not the last 4 stroke or so. I didn't have great success with it at Indy but I had better spliting at a inseason. I am still trying to work out the kinks on this. But, for the 100 fly, I am just doing to do 2 up, 1 down approach. I don't have the Phelpsian speed to do that on the 100 fly. I hope to figure this out soon though. But, for the 400 IM, breathe every stroke, that I was able to solve. on the 200IM , i breath every other but the 400 IM , 2 up 1 down . unless on the last 25 i need more air then every. as an asthmatic, this is the better solution for me.

This is what I mostly do. 5x200 butterfly slow and relaxed. My purpose is to be ready by september to do a lot of base mileage (in a squad) at my specialty stroke (Butterfly of course). These 200 are swam at a pace I could hold for a full kilo. And this volume done at low intensity allows me to perfect the following: - Breathing without spending energy in doing so - Reducing drag resistance - Improving my pulling and more importantly, my arm recovering action (this aspect can be problematic during a 200bf race) Is this working for you? Can you speed it up where you want it? I have been told (and read on this forum, possibly quoting Ande, "slow fly equals no fly"). I also was told in a video clinic that swimming slow fly will never make me swim fast fly. So, is this approach helping you attain the speed you want?

I have tried, but it messes up my rhythm. My hips tend to drop and I tire quickly. I think it is in part due to the fact that I have a very weak kick. But now that you have suggested that it could be a good way to improve the kick, I think I will be doing it more in the future.

You know I come from the other end of the spectrum: I cannot for the life of me figure out how to do the butterfly without breathing every stroke. Keeping my head down seems to limit my body action and truncate my entire stroke. Add the breath and I am able to undulate my entire body and bring into play the muscles of my torso. I actually marvel at the guys that are able to keep their heads down for even one stroke; if I tried that I can guarantee you I would flood a lung by the third stroke. My brother was a nationally ranked flyer (in Canada, in the seventies), he helped teach me and as a result I actually was always told I had a very nice fly technically. I never actually tried in the stroke and thus never managed to do much of anything in competition. I now am quite satisfied if I complete 50 meters of butterfly non-stop without flooding my lungs.

I hope I am not being too redundant (I am truly sorry if I am). Like I explained in an other Fly thread, I have been (successfully) working on an innovative approach to Butterfly for the past 3 months. I mainly train (and trained) as a Cyclist but I intend to resume intensive swim training by late september. In preparation for this, my current swim schedule involves 1 or 2 workouts per week, 1 kilo each. This is what I mostly do. 5x200 butterfly slow and relaxed. My purpose is to be ready by september to do a lot of base mileage (in a squad) at my specialty stroke (Butterfly of course). These 200 are swam at a pace I could hold for a full kilo. And this volume done at low intensity allows me to perfect the following: - Breathing without spending energy in doing so - Reducing drag resistance - Improving my pulling and more importantly, my arm recovering action (this aspect can be problematic during a 200bf race) Note that during these 200s, I breathe every two on the first 50, then every stroke for 150m. I am not suggesting that you should mimic my stroke mechanics since it probably has flaws related to swimming that slow, but I just post this as a proof that it is indeed possible to develop a *Base endurance* sort of slow butterfly that allows for improving a lot of energy efficiency aspects (breathing, drag etc). YouTube - Base endurance Butterfly - Full stroke (Side View)

I breathe every stroke. My kick is very weak to nonexistant. I am pretty buoyant though. On entry, I leave my hands and head nearer the water surface but press the chest and air-filled lungs deeper so the hips rise. Elbows stay high. There is a rebound at just the right time in the stroke to take a nice big relaxed breath. Without this gentle body undulation I also can't recover the arms without dragging them through the water. I swim pretty flat since I don't have leg drive to support a big amplitude and that helps me focus on moving forward. Jutting the chin forward or lifting my head to breathe constricted my airway and made my neck tired, so I keep my head mostly inline in a relaxed position. Fly is a lot more fun if you get plenty of air.

I wonder if breathing to the side will help keep your body in better position? According to most experts, no. However, I trained a butterfly specialist back in the '90s which had a lot of success with it (his 200M bf was under 2min). You'd have to have a lot of neck and upperbody flexibility I guess to see a real benefit in doing this.

Is this working for you? Can you speed it up where you want it? I have been told (and read on this forum, possibly quoting Ande, "slow fly equals no fly"). This is why I called it an innovative approach. I realized that I am pretty much alone in my camp, and this is how I like things anyway ;-) I train for the 200, event for which I am aiming for gold at next state (province) championship. Ande is pretty right in that the technique to swim slow and that to swim fast is different. Does that mean one can't train the two? My slow freestyle doesn't look (or feel) anywhere near my sprint freestyle. It's almost two different strokes (6beat high on the water vs energy efficient 2beat). I already listed few benefits of this strategy earlier in the thread, but here's one more. When I climb on the block for the competition, I'll be swimming against folks that are basically scared of performing the 200 butterfly. Me, I will have completed probably between 200 and 500 times 200 butterfly at all sorts of speed. I will be hungry for a 200 bf. Not scared. I guess that my quest is about stopping being scared to swim the butterfly. Not sure where it's going to bring me but so far I really enjoy the process.

I've always tried to breathe every other stroke in fly, but watching the elites at Worlds breathe every stroke made me want to try it out. So recently I experimented with breathing every stroke in fly. Findings after a couple workouts where I averaged about 600 total yards of full-stroke fly: Breathing every stroke has a negative impact on my body position I can help that by kicking harder The additional oxygen that I get from all the extra breathing helps fuel the harder kicking, but it seems like I'm working harder overall (higher perceived pulse rate at the end of each swim, but I didn't actually measure it) Stroke counts and times are about the same So I think I've found a useful drill to make me kick harder, but I doubt I'll be trying this in a race anytime soon. Has anyone else (who hasn't always swum fly this way) messed around with breathing every stroke in fly? What were your findings? I am still trying to figure this out. I tend to breathe every stroke on the fly leg on my 400 IM(went out at 1:08 at Indy). In the 200 fly, I tend to breathe every stroke for the first 100, attempt to breathe 3 stroke, then skip a breathe on the third 50 and breathe every stroke on the last 50 but not the last 4 stroke or so. I didn't have great success with it at Indy but I had better spliting at a inseason. I am still trying to work out the kinks on this. But, for the 100 fly, I am just doing to do 2 up, 1 down approach. I don't have the Phelpsian speed to do that on the 100 fly. I hope to figure this out soon though. But, for the 400 IM, breathe every stroke, that I was able to solve.