I searched and couldn't find this posted, but I could have missed it.
Anyways, its pretty interesting because the official basically says Cavic touched first, but didn't "push" and slid, while Phelps pushed with force, etc etc. (He talks about this right at halfway through the video)
www.swimchampions.com/.../
Personally I think you have to live with however the time system works as long as it is functional. If it was functional and Cavic didn't press hard enough, its tough luck.
The only alternative is to just present a "tie" when you are within the margin of error of the equipment.
It looks like Cavic probably touched before. I remember the last time I watched the clip (on the Worlds coverage) I saw Cavic with his hands oustretched not moving, and then Phelps moving in and touching. It's hard to tell completely if Cavic is touching. But it looks like he really could be touching. And for Cavic to not be touching already would mean that he would have been just floating still. Which to me isn't possible or likely.
We can look at videos until we are blue in the face, and well people can make pictures say whatever they want it to see. In the end, I didn't then, and I don't now really care who won that race.
I find it very hard to believe people think they can clearly see something that took .01 seconds. :confused:
Does anyone remember if they had back up timers on the deck in Bejing? If so - and I would imagine there were - what if anything did that show on the time?
If they used the same system as US Olympic Trials, which I believe they did, there were no human backup timers but high speed cameras above each lane to capture times if the pads fail. Those would be the interesting photos to see as they're the official finish photos. I believe that was what the timing officials were reviewing when Cavic filed the protest immediately after the race. Too bad Omega probably will never release those photos.
But yes, the race is over, Phelps is the winner, and we'll probably never be absolutely certain 100% exactly what happened.
And for Cavic to not be touching already would mean that he would have been just floating still.
No it doesn't. It just means his hands were moving forward slower than Phelps' were.
I base my argument that Phelps won on three major facts:
1. The pad recorded his touch .01 second before Cavic.
2. The photo series published by SI shows Phelps clearly touching the wall while Cavic appears not to be yet. Some people disagree and suggest Cavic is also touching in this photo. If so--at best--this is only evidence of a tie, not a victory for Cavic.
3. Serbia protested, but withdrew their protest after seeing the official video.
1) No one is doubting that Phelps activated the pad first. The entire dispute is wether the pad functioned correctly when *some* believe the photos/video show Cavic touching first.
Apparently *some* do, but so far no one has shown any evidence showing Cavic touching first in this thread. Really, I'd love to see it. And, just for the record, I'm not trying to argue with you, David. I keep hearing there's evidence showing Cavic touched first, but no one seems to have it.
1625Pic of the finish
If you click on the photo, you can see how Cavic's fingers haven't touch the T, but Phelps has clearly hit the wall. Case closed.
Yeah, I'm beginning to believe those who say Cavic touched first are just doing this to irritate the rest of us. It does NOT look like Cavic touched first in any photo or video I've seen. Please show me a picture where it looks like Cavic touched first! Unless someone can do this how can you possibly doubt the timing system? Some yahoo from Omega claiming Cavic touched first is not evidence.
It looks like Cavic probably touched before. I remember the last time I watched the clip (on the Worlds coverage) I saw Cavic with his hands oustretched not moving, and then Phelps moving in and touching. It's hard to tell completely if Cavic is touching. But it looks like he really could be touching. And for Cavic to not be touching already would mean that he would have been just floating still. Which to me isn't possible or likely.
We can look at videos until we are blue in the face, and well people can make pictures say whatever they want it to see. In the end, I didn't then, and I don't now really care who won that race.
Kirk, I showed you the NY times picture which was taken .01 or .02 before the SI photo. I think Cavic's finger appears on the wall and Phelps does not.
See, I think that one appears to show neither one quite to the wall yet. Cavic certainly looks closer, but it doesn't look to me like he's touched yet.
What a great race! Cavic and Phelps both deserved Gold - but it doesn't work that way.
I think that the winner is the one who touches the finish line first. Cavic supporters are claiming that the outside edge of the pad is the finish line. If you are using touchpads the finish line is a bit further - that very small distance that the pad must move to trigger the timing system.
I agree Frank! We all learned how to hit the pad as we were instructed to & learned by trial & error. I have had new swimmers hit the top all the time.
In my experience, hitting the top of the pad is about the only way you won't trigger it and that's taken out of the equation with these FINA events where the pad extends out of the water. As geek said, maybe an 8 and under won't trigger the pad on the finish, but it's hard to believe a 200 pound man swimming at work record speed won't!
