I searched and couldn't find this posted, but I could have missed it.
Anyways, its pretty interesting because the official basically says Cavic touched first, but didn't "push" and slid, while Phelps pushed with force, etc etc. (He talks about this right at halfway through the video)
www.swimchampions.com/.../
Personally I think you have to live with however the time system works as long as it is functional. If it was functional and Cavic didn't press hard enough, its tough luck.
The only alternative is to just present a "tie" when you are within the margin of error of the equipment.
I agree with ehoch that whoever touches first should win. I just don't see any photos that show Cavic touching first. To me it doesn't look like Cavic is touching the wall in the NY Times photo.
Wow - I always thought Cavic was a bit crazy ... but this is interesting.
Should they go to instant replay for swimming decisions like this ?
I am mean - the winner should be the one first to the wall, and apparently that is Cavic.
The point is that "whoever touches the wall first should win" - not whoever triggers some touchpad mechanism. Isn't that the point of racing ? You against me - first one to the wall wins.
Good luck with that. I'd much rather rely on touchpads than the human eye when it comes to close finishes.
Wow - I always thought Cavic was a bit crazy ... but this is interesting.
Should they go to instant replay for swimming decisions like this ?
I am mean - the winner should be the one first to the wall, and apparently that is Cavic.
They could also just have a swim-off with just those 2 swimmers. I tied for 3rd place in my District Championship 50 free SCY meet early in high school and we had to swim off at the end of the meet. 3rd place was important b/c that was the cutoff to get to the State Championship meet. Even at a small meet, it was pretty exciting, I can only imagine what an Olympic swim-off would be like.
I dont remember if when I tied, they were using tenths or hundreths of a second, but the time board showed the same time for both of us. By that standard, Phelps would still have won since his time was better on the time board.
Good luck with that. I'd much rather rely on touchpads than the human eye when it comes to close finishes.
We wouldn't need to rely on the human eye--we could rely on high speed cameras. Perhaps for any finish less than .02 or something they should automatically go to the cameras. Sort of like replay cameras in other sports, the cameras would have to show irrefutable evidence of one swimmer touching first to overrule the timing system.
edit: The cameras would also need to be triggered to record one frame every .01 second since that's the agreed upon resolution for timing in swimming. You definitely wouldn't want to use the cameras to break ties, for example.
I don't see how this reconciles with the photos of the finish taken from underwater. In the photos we can see Phelps touching the wall while Cavic has not. Unless Cavic somehow touched and rebounded it seems that Phelps touched first to me.
Personally I think it was Phelps, but I have looked at all the pictures and I dont think any of them are close enough to show fingers clearly touching a pad. I think you could argue on any of them that either swimmer's fingers are an inch away or a half inch away or touching, it needs to be closer.
they do a photo finish with high speed cameras in track
Of course track finishes are harder to judge because any part of your body could cross the line first. Same technically goes for swimming, but for all intents and purposes it's your fingers that touch first 99.9% of the time.
At D3 nats in 1998 a backstroker touched first in his heat, but missed the pad because it didn't extend to the corner of the lane where the swimmer touched. The coach protested but lost because a rule was written to describe the exact situation (you have to touch the touch pad). I don't know, but I would be surprised if there wasn't a rule clarifying the Phelps/ Cavic situation too.
