Masters Swimmers Acting Like Triathletes

Is there a contest going on for Mr. or Mrs. Cool? I guess since I have a blog and a stupid shot of myself being goofy that I am out of the running. Apparently it is not cool to have a blog. Maybe instead of a blog list, there needs to be a code of conduct that delineates appropriate, non-compulsive, conformist behavior. Of course there would need to be a code of conduct committee that would decide when the said code had been violated. From reading this thread, I can already guess who would be on the committee. Lighten up and accept people the way they are - compulsive, over-the-top, laid-back, intense, etc. What makes masters swimming fun to me is the different personalities and people accepting others for the way they are.

Ah c'mon, let people have running obsessions. I had to put mine on ice (along with my foot but that's for another thread) due to an injury. Thank God for swimming, so I can maintain at least ONE obsession. ;) I am quite slow as a swimmer, so I really can't speak of my times as competitive at all, and I have no illusions that I'll be setting records (except personal ones) any time soon. I haven't the budget for a tech suit, so I can only fantasize about how such a suit would affect my swimming. Thing is, though, I have a lot to learn about swimming before a tech suit would really do much for my swimming. I've bought gadgets and high tech stuff for running when the opportunity and my budget allowed, and I don't begrudge anyone the enjoyment of whatever gear makes them happy. No doubt people could criticize my purchases too, so I can't judge what others buy for their sport. When I do a workout or race, I definitely am competitive, and if there's someone close to my speed, I'm competitive with that person, but only during the workout/race. Afterward, we're cool. Like the poster on page 3, I tend to be more suspicious when someone says "I'm not competitive." And I don't think that being competitive is just for the front of the pack. In a run I did a few years ago, I was having a very slow day, and found myself battling for second-last place with a woman who had run quite fast in her younger days but was close to seventy and also having a slow day. We didn't give each other an inch! She'd pass me, then I'd return the favor, then she would--all the way to the finish. We then enjoyed post-race snacks, conversation, catching up...and congratulated each other on putting up a good fight. We both knew we weren't contenders, but we saw no reason not to make a race of it between ourselves. But no, I can't quit my day job to get sponsorship for running or (even less so) swimming. Oh, sponsors might pay me to wear their competitors' gear. (If only, ha ha!) ;) But the reason I love to do masters' swimming (and, when my body is up for it, running workouts) is the thrill of the chase. Can I beat that guy who always gets me in the running workouts by a hair? Can I improve my 50s or 100s in swimming--not to break 1:30, just to break 2! I have no worries about impressing anyone, but it's still cool to see what I can do if I push myself in these venues. There's something so refreshing about the simplicity of seeing how fast one can move through water or on land without all the mucking up of daily life. And no doubt I've had days where I get discouraged enough with my swimming to sound more obsessed than normal. But I don't have that many regrets. There are always more races.

"Cater"..... of course not..... "try to attract".... yes. These are individuals with great experiences and knowledge to share with others in the sport, not to mention their potential friendship. Most would enjoy working out and racing for fun, but most don't feel it's "real" competition compared to their previous experience. Sometimes they are amused by what they see. e.g...... when they hear or see a participant getting wrapped around the axel because their performance wasn't included in a USMS top 10 listing, they think it all seems a bit ........ well......... ridiculous. So you are talking about clashing attitudes of two camps: those who are excited to compete as masters and those who do not deign to do so. What I guess I hear you saying is that you would like to find some way to dampen this enthusiasm by not, for instance, making such a "big deal" about Top Ten, or records, etc. Maybe by doing away with them altogether. So let us put aside egos and emotions and just ponder this idea for a minute. Certainly such a move would anger some people, but are they perhaps a vocal few? Would it make USMS a more attractive place for those -- whether they are former elites or not -- who currently are turned off by the competitive aspects of masters swimming? My own thoughts: -- I suppose there are some people who do not compete because they feel that some take it too "seriously" and are turned off. I think this is a small number of people, and that most do not compete b/c they simply don't want to be bothered to give up weekends and spend time & money to do so. They are happy just going to practice and staying fit, and need no further motivation to do so. I don't see how de-emphasizing or eliminating Top Ten or national records will attract these people. -- This is the sport of *competitive* swimming, is it not? I don't think the stopwatch should ever be eliminated. The pools are of regulation lengths, so that means there can and will be comparisons. (In this sense, this sport if very UNLIKE triathlons, where course and conditions play a huge role in performance.) That means people who go to meets will get times for their swims and can make of them what they wish: they can chart their own improvement (or not!) and/or they can compare to others. -- Personally, although I am focused on time-based goals, I would have a difficult time without comparison to others to provide some context. Almost everyone gets slower with age and that's a little depressing...so the question is, am I get slower relative to others of my same age? So in that sense, I don't need formal "top ten" recognition or anything, a simple ranking would be fine. (In fact, I think that ranking should extend beyond 10 to be most useful to members who compete. That is in the works, I believe.) -- I do agree strongly that, at the club, LMSC and national level, we should go to a lot of effort to recognize and celebrate all types of swimmers, not just the "ultra-competitive" types. I think USMS does try to do those kinds of things too, with events like Go The Distance and new tools like the Fitness Logs. -- Finally, for those former swimmers who are turned off by competitions, I would recommend Open Water swimming. Times are less meaningful there, there are no records (except for the cable swims) nor are there Top Ten listings. While OW events are held as races and naturally some take it pretty seriously, the sense of accomplishment from just finishing a race is pretty significant. Of course, this recommendation is more than a little ironic, given the title of the thread...:)

"Cater"..... of course not..... "try to attract".... yes. These are individuals with great experiences and knowledge to share with others in the sport, not to mention their potential friendship. Most would enjoy working out and racing for fun, but most don't feel it's "real" competition compared to their previous experience. Sometimes they are amused by what they see. e.g...... when they hear or see a participant getting wrapped around the axel because their performance wasn't included in a USMS top 10 listing, they think it all seems a bit ........ well......... ridiculous. Who are you? And who is this vague mass of "national level finalists" you speak of? You sure make them sound like snobs. I personally don't feel like I'm missing out on the friendship of anyone who would be so condescending. Likely, it's one person you know who had a negative experience with some other person on your team or in your area. I certainly don't see this as a general trend.

I'm not reading Mr. Negative as saying being competitive is a bad thing...I'm seeing it more as mocking of a very small number of adult athletes who are so far over the top thats its kind of embarrassing. I had the "pleasure" of meeting just such a person at a workout i coached earlier this week. A woman in her late 40's was visiting from another town, she rolled into the parking lot in a car that had every possibly Yakima rack attachment on top, multiple Ironman stickers and a vanity plate...she was spoting an ironman tattoo on her ankle, wore an ironman cap, had 3 sets of paddles, 2 sets of fins, etc. but couldn't make 100's (LCM) on 3:00 and barked at me for moving her to a slower lane (where Laura was coaching, ha!). She challenged every set, lectured us on how bad kicking work was, shared her race schedule...on and on and on. Again a rare case...but one that even the soft spoken world class pro who was training with us pointed out "gave our sport a bad name".

Too bad.... as there are a lot of Ex's out there that would enjoy casual workouts, sharing their past, and finding amusement in a race once or twice a year. Doesn't seem like they need amusement from racing. Sounds like they are already amused merely by watching other swimmers with "lesser talent" attempt to compete in what is not "real competition." I'm amused just reading the condescension dripping from your posts! I haven't really witnessed much of the over-the-top behavior you and Pablo report. I'm sure there are some who take things very seriously, but this doesn't seem much different from those taking other aspects of life seriously. Certainly better than seeing loco parents get expelled from soccer or baseball fields. As Pablo notes, lying about your age or taking PEDs is, in fact, out of control though.

What I guess I hear you saying is that you would like to find some way to dampen this enthusiasm by not, for instance, making such a "big deal" about Top Ten, or records, etc. Maybe by doing away with them altogether. I don't know. It seems to me one of the tactics that's been used to get these former greats into USMS is by dangling the possibility of setting a relay world record, etc. in front of them. Isn't that right, John...er, Mr. Negative?

Of course there many ex national finalists that are turned off by the intensity and success of lessor talents. Many roll their eyes at the thought of taking USMS for anything more serious than health and fun. Are these the same people who thought Auburn only won NCAAs this year because they wore "cheater" Jaked suits?

Finally.... a rational and unthreatened response What, you're allowed to ridicule others and post ridiculous nonsense, but we're not allowed to ridicule you back? I haven't had this much fun on the DF in ages. :) I doubt, moreover, that anyone is "threatened" by your rhetoric. Just amused that people might actually think this way.

Why does it appear many masters swimmers are taking USMS so seriously? What's the difference between the typical "selfish train all day", "it's all about me" triathlete and a masters swimmer who seriously trains as hard as they can.... particularly to focus on setting masters records? Seems like there is a growing parallel between triathletes and many masters swimmers these days. Isn't it just "masters swimming" for health and fun in the end? Does a masters record really mean that much? Is this a good thing? ..... or a turn off for those who look on with amusement. A masters record really should mean that much. I'll never get one, so I am simply in awe of those that do hold a masters record. It is easy to swim fast at 20 because one doesn't have to balance a job and a family. It is easy to swim fast at 20 because one hasn't had an injury, illness, or pregnancy that has kept one of out the pool for months. It is hard to swim fast at 40 when one has to balance a job and family. It is hard to swim fast at 40 when one has had to overcome a debilitating illness or injury. Hats off to the folks out there setting masters records! I'm grateful as I am sure many other masters swimmers are that I can swim and compete, especially after losing a good friend to cancer at 39. I see my ability to swim and compete (even if I am just an average masters swimmer) as a gift. I don't seen anything wrong with getting intense about something that should be valued.