I think we can all be certain that the suits are here to stay -- love them, hate them, it does not really matter -- Speedo, TYR and the others will not allow the suits to all over sudden disappear.
But, we as Masters swimmers have to make a decision about our own reasoning to compete -- why do we compete in swim meets ?
There are many reasons - social, participating in a sport beats the hell out of watching one on TV and so on --- but for me, 2 of the main reasons are the competition aspects. We obviously compete against other swimmers --- but more than maybe many other sports, we compete against ourselves. I can tell you my best 100 Free from every season over the last 30 years (10 of which I did not compete).
I have used most of the suits and did very well -- I set some personal bests and also achieved some record swims, but I have no idea how my times really compare to other seasons. I can keep telling myself that all that speedwork and lifting paid off - but I just don't know.
I like to give a golf comparison -- let's say you have a home course and you always shoot in the low 90s going from the Blue Tees --- well guess what, if you are going from the white tees you will probably average high 80s and going from the red you may get down to the mid to low 80s. But you are not a better player because of it. The LZR seems to be the "white tees" and the new Jaked suit may be the "red tees".
I think we really have to make a decision now to what matters more -- your personal records and history of swimming or the competition against other swimmers ? For me, this may change from meet to meet - but I must be able to stay honest with myself and be able to compare my times -- I do not want to be cheating myself.
Old generations suits (Fastskin Pro) only for: all major Masters meets (individual swims) except for Worlds. That means, I am ok to lose a few places in a meet, in order to know what my time really means. I could just go really old school -- but I think the older generation suits are pretty equal to shaving -- and they allow you to be "shaved" and swim fast in season, which is a huge plus.
LZR / Blue70 for: relays, Worlds and maybe some USS meets, if I am going for a time standard. I want to give any relay my fastest time possible - I swimming Worlds to win the title, so if others use the suits, I will have to do the same - if I go to USS meets, I may use them to get into the finals or to make a time standard for a big meet.
It may take some adjustments - but I think it will work --
Who is with me ?
Cowardly? The folks I've spoken are taking the higher ground and accepting as they are the things they cannot change and certianly not "crying"...pointing out in private with friends however how an "average" swimmer in a Jaked suit can do what they are doing is fair game.
I thought you'd said the Jaked was history anyway? And no masters that I know of aside from Vlad P. are wearing them. If this is a masters thread (see title and call to arms), where's all the huge "tragedy"?
If Ehoch wants to know precisely how much he's improving vis-a-vis his prior times, he can wear his Pro. Or keep a log of his B70 and LZR times, which I assume he has anyway. When a person has worn the same suit a zillion times, are all improvements due to suit?!
Cowardly? The folks I've spoken are taking the higher ground and accepting as they are the things they cannot change and certianly not "crying"...pointing out in private with friends however how an "average" swimmer in a Jaked suit can do what they are doing is fair game.
Good point but still the lack of public statements from any of the 'elite' on this issue is disturbing and bothersome. I guess I was a bit harsh but this whole suit thing is buggin the living :censor: out of me and the blame falls squarely on FINA and no where else.
Cowardly? The folks I've spoken are taking the higher ground and accepting as they are the things they cannot change and certianly not "crying"...pointing out in private with friends however how an "average" swimmer in a Jaked suit can do what they are doing is fair game.
So, does this make you their spokesmodel?
Oh, and what someone allegedly says in private, someone who's opinion might be respected, really doesn't register at all.
Either does posting the names of a bunch of Olympians and insinuating that just because they haven't spoken up publicly means they are OK with things.
But right now, we are all trying to swim as fast as possible in suits that will be made illegal in 8 months ?
Some of us would like to get our money out of our suits. Others of us would like to keep wearing the same suit as long as it's legal to see if our times improve while keeping the "suit factor" constant. Or is that impossible in your view?
The only sad part about the suits for masters is that it apparently erases any real improvement or means that it is completely overshadowed. Everything is attributed to the tech suit.
Either does posting the names of a bunch of Olympians and insinuating that just because they haven't spoken up publicly means they are OK with things.
Exactly, so we are saying the same thing, let people who want to speak do so themselves as opposed to alleging they said it at cocktail hour.
But - I don't believe in just congratulating Bousquet on swimming under 21 seconds in the 50m Free - like there is nothing else to talk about.
I do admit this is terribly fishy as well.
Exactly, so we are saying the same thing, let people who want to speak do so themselves as opposed to alleging they said it at cocktail hour.
I called you a weenie again today at cocktail hour...just in case you hear someone else mention it.
I don't think there should be official rules and I am fine with whatever FINA does. I don't fault anybody for wearing the suits and I will probably wear one for certain events (that I don't have a history of swimming in) - but I think we as swimmers need to be honest with ourselves - and the new suits make that very difficult.
Not picking on you Fortress - but here are 2 statements from you just from your response and recent blog all of us are going to have to deal with :
" can "honestly" determine how I'm doing based on those times"
then on the first page of the blog :
1 Livingston, Les 47 GMUP 29.10 27.90! 9
Last year at Zones, I swam a 29.5, so this is a big drop in a 50 for one year.
I looked up her best time from last year - 28.5 -- so that is a 0.6 sec drop --- so how much faster did the last year of training make her ?????
So it's just a personal choice -- for my main events, I want to know how I am doing compared to last year, and 5 years ago.
