As if the whole running thing wasn't enough:
Study: Triathlons can pose deadly heart risks
March 28th, 2009 By MARILYNN MARCHIONE , AP Medical Writer (AP) -- Warning to weekend warriors: Swim-bike-run triathlons pose at least twice the risk of sudden death as marathons do, the first study of these competitions has found.
www.physorg.com/news157482153.html
Don't blame the weak swimmers for a race director's decision to cancel the swim portion of a triathlon. Blame lawyers, our legal system, and juries.
I still support this as I feel it has been justified.
You are obviously a plaintiffs' lawyer. Save it for the Trial Lawyers Association meeting.
I'm not a plaintiff's lawyer. I live in a very small town, and have a small town general practice. I defend at least as often as I represent the plaintiff. I am not a member of any trial lawyer's association.
Exactly why one of the single most important changes that could/should occur in our society is to have plaintiff's pay the defendents legal costs if they lose.
Whether we would benefit from implementing a loser pays system is a worthy subject of dialogue. But note that defendants who delay payment of viable claims should be equally liable for a claim for attorney fees, not just plaintiffs who pursue unsuccessful claims.
I firmly believe that liability releases are pointless, kind of like the big sign on the back of the gravel truck that says they aren't responsible for rocks flying off the truck, which you can read as your car is getting pelted with gravel.
Please don't let the pesky fact that releases are generally valid ever stand in the way of your "firm belief." For what it's worth, there are solid, meaty public policy reasons that persons should not be entitled to prospectively obtain a release of future negligence (for a good primer, read the Hiett case I cited earlier), but this is a swim forum, where we debate issues like the relative merits of tech suits, elevator repair, EVF, and Late Bloomers, not the vagaries of the american legal system.
Top reasons not to participate:
1. The fees! After nearly 125 cycling races (road track and cyclocross), plus years of masters swimming, I was not prepared for the cost just to race...just to enter. What a rip off. Some go to charities but most go into someone's pockets.
I agree. I briefly looked into triathlons, to enter as a relay, and decided it was just too much of a production (pre-race briefing the day before, etc) and too expensive. I do a few open water swims every summer and that's plenty for me.
BillS - You make some good points. In mentioning lawyers, I was merely trying to deflect the blame from the individuals who struggle with their swimming. What is in the mind of the race director is probably a combination of things - the weak swimmers, the moral duty to be concerned about the safety of the participants, and legal liability.
It's easier to pick on lawyers because I am one and sometimes, in jest, you have to beat up on folks that make a profit out of other people's mistakes. Much easier to do that than pick on people that overestimate their swimming abilities.
Don't blame the weak swimmers for a race director's decision to cancel the swim portion of a triathlon. Blame lawyers, our legal system, and juries.
I'm sick to death of this kind of baseless, unsupported hit and run crap. Can you provide even one citation to a reported case affirming liability? Or a case that went to judgment? Or even a case that was filed? Please, spare me the "I heard from so and so who knows a former race director who told so and so's second cousin (twice removed) that the swim might have been canceled due to liability concerns." Provide the county and court of filing and date of judgment.
Liability releases are valid and enforceable in most jurisdictions throughout the United States, and are a strong deterrent to claims.
A quick search of all 50 states for "Triathlon and liability" turned up a whopping 22 hits. (If that seems like a lot of hits to anyone, try searching for "golf and liability", or "bicycle and liability", or "SCUBA and liability"). I found exactly one case which might be read as having a chilling effect on triathlons, Hiett v. Lake Bancroft Community Assoc., 244 Va. 191, 418 S.E.2d 894 (1992). The triathlete in Hiett struck his head on an underwater object during the swim portion, resulting in quadraplegia. Relying on about a century of Virginia case law, the Virginia Supreme Court invalidated a release and overturned a grant of summary judgment to the race organizers, remanding the case to the trial court. We don't know what happened to the case from there, but frankly, if the race organizers failed to properly check the swim area, they deserve to be held liable.
A later California decision considering the validity of releases signed by developmentally disabled minors (Santa Barbara v. Superior Court, 41 Cal.4th 747, 161 P.2d 1095, 62 Cal.Rptr.3d 527 (2007)) noted that Hiett had evidently not had much impact on the availability of triathlons in Virginia:
The same appears to be true concerning nonprofit
sporting events. For example, as plaintiffs observe, 14 years
after the Virginia Supreme Court in Hiett, supra,
418 S.E.2d 894, voided an agreement releasing liability for future
ordinary negligence relating to participation in a triathlon,
at least 60 triathlons, biathlons, and duathlons were held in
Virginia in 2006, and at least that many have been scheduled
for 2007. (See .)
In short, there is no epidemic of lawsuits arising out of swimmers drowning in triathlons. Perhaps the race director canceling a swim made a smart decision, based on the conditions (too windy, too cold, large surf, lack of support vehicles, etc.) I suspect the thought of bearing the moral or human responsibility for the death or injury of a swimmer has a lot more to do with the decision than any thought of legal responsibility. And most any reputable event and organizer will have event insurance, generally available through the sanctioning organization, in place to cover the legal side.
I think your blame of the legal system is misplaced.
Chris - excellent post. I have to agree on many of your points but most notably on the fitness of the tri crowd. Couple that with all the flashy gear and I feel downright out of place when I bust out my ancient suit and swedes. It is a very buff crowd, ShePuff buff, if you will.
The completion versus competition is also something I see a lot. I don't understand the "I just want to finish" mentality of tris but it is quite evident. Obviously, a full IM is a notable exception. You finish that, you get a pass in my book. The only way I can explain it is that if you are a good swimmer you grew up racing and you understand what it means to race. Not many of us grew up doing triathlons so maybe there is less of a racing mentality. Who knows, although at the elite level, those guys and gals are animals.
Congrats on passing someone on the bike leg. That has yet to happen to me. I average about 17.2 mph and get passed by elderly people on those red scooter things.
When I saw this article and decided to post it I wanted to see what kind of reaction it would get from some Triathletes who hang out on this forum. As a coach I continue to allow my frustration to build when multisport athletes attend my workouts and opt out of what I would consider helpful workouts...which most of the time (IMHO) I fell do just the opposite.
A perfect example the other day was a gal who refused to do any drill/technique work and in the past has also bailed on quality sets. Instead slipping off to an open lane to do a long swim (my quality workouts are often between 1500-2000 yards with a lot of rest). My thoughts are that this person would be better served working on the efficiency of her stroke so as to be able to complete aa long swim not fatigued...she doesn't see it that way.
Even worse is when I see triathletes training on their own at my gym...to me these folks are the higher risk candidates for having problems on the swim. So often working so hard and not progressing...
Chris - excellent post. I have to agree on many of your points but most notably on the fitness of the tri crowd. Couple that with all the flashy gear and I feel downright out of place when I bust out my ancient suit and swedes. It is a very buff crowd, ShePuff buff, if you will.
The completion versus competition is also something I see a lot. I don't understand the "I just want to finish" mentality of tris but it is quite evident. Obviously, a full IM is a notable exception. You finish that, you get a pass in my book. The only way I can explain it is that if you are a good swimmer you grew up racing and you understand what it means to race. Not many of us grew up doing triathlons so maybe there is less of a racing mentality. Who knows, although at the elite level, those guys and gals are animals.
Congrats on passing someone on the bike leg. That has yet to happen to me. I average about 17.2 mph and get passed by elderly people on those red scooter things.
Some even go just to check out the scenery. One time I gave a friend of mine grief when he asked one of our other friends to move because he was "blocking his view."
When I gave him grief about it, he replied, "If God didn't intend for us to look, he would have made everybody look the same." :laugh2:
