I'm having a hard time with the Blue 70.
I love it. I swam faster than I deserved to in it (I bought it until it ripped, then returned), and I had fun swimming faster again!
My question/statement is this:
It is more than obvious from my own experience, and MANY swimmers I've talked to, that you drop at least 3 seconds per 50 in any event wearing this suit. I know that last year I swam a morning race and went 38 without the suit, put one on and swam the same event and went 35. I sure as heck didn't taper in an hour! And I can't remember dropping 3 seconds in a 50 in recent decades.
Highly respected "people" in USMS that I have had conversations with say it is undoubtedly "legalized cheating". I agree. I'm not quite sure how or why FINA approved it. (And I'm not saying it should be banned. It is what it is.) But when a SUIT improves performance it is no longer necessarily the swimmer achieving those times.
My hubby brought up the cost as well. (I have a suit fund going, so we don't have to shell out $400 all at once, if I even buy one.) It definitely separates the haves from the have nots. There are many more Masters Swimmers who cannot afford this suit than those who can. Several of my teammates would love one but can't afford it. And while this may be more a "social" question, it is still a factor in our swimming races.
My thought, as I was looking at recent results was this: Because the B70 is such a factor in racing performance, I would love to see some kind of a notation (notice I didn't say the dreaded Barry Bonds asterisk!) next to results of swimmers who wear a B70 in a race. Or have a B70 division for all results? We already have a wetsuit division for OW, why not have a B70 division for pool races? (It is almost a wetsuit anyway!)
This past weekend I watched an already elite swimmer wear a B70 and annhilate their already super fast times. If I were a swimmer from another part of the country, I'd be thinking, "Good God, how much faster can they get?" When if fact they aren't necessarily much faster, they are now wearing a B70.
When is technology too much?
2cents
Karen
We've been arguing this for at least 8 months now. I suggest you ask Dolphin 2 as he is the ultimate authority on this topic. We all defer to him on this matter.
I'm having a hard time with the Blue 70.
I love it. I swam faster than I deserved to in it (I bought it until it ripped, then returned), and I had fun swimming faster again!
My question/statement is this:
It is more than obvious from my own experience, and MANY swimmers I've talked to, that you drop at least 3 seconds per 50 in any event wearing this suit. I know that last year I swam a morning race and went 38 without the suit, put one on and swam the same event and went 35. I sure as heck didn't taper in an hour! And I can't remember dropping 3 seconds in a 50 in recent decades.
Highly respected "people" in USMS that I have had conversations with say it is undoubtedly "legalized cheating". I agree. I'm not quite sure how or why FINA approved it. (And I'm not saying it should be banned. It is what it is.) But when a SUIT improves performance it is no longer necessarily the swimmer achieving those times.
My hubby brought up the cost as well. (I have a suit fund going, so we don't have to shell out $400 all at once, if I even buy one.) It definitely separates the haves from the have nots. There are many more Masters Swimmers who cannot afford this suit than those who can. Several of my teammates would love one but can't afford it. And while this may be more a "social" question, it is still a factor in our swimming races.
My thought, as I was looking at recent results was this: Because the B70 is such a factor in racing performance, I would love to see some kind of a notation (notice I didn't say the dreaded Barry Bonds asterisk!) next to results of swimmers who wear a B70 in a race. Or have a B70 division for all results? We already have a wetsuit division for OW, why not have a B70 division for pool races? (It is almost a wetsuit anyway!)
This past weekend I watched an already elite swimmer wear a B70 and annhilate their already super fast times. If I were a swimmer from another part of the country, I'd be thinking, "Good God, how much faster can they get?" When if fact they aren't necessarily much faster, they are now wearing a B70.
When is technology too much?
2cents
Karen
No way is it 3 seconds! Sorry sweetie, but that's flat out ridiculous!!!! Based on my own comparative 50 times, I think it's at most .3 per 50 faster than a Pro, which is a fast suit too. And I've raced in both suits extensively. I've also swum just as fast in 50s in an FSI and Pro, so the B70s not a magic bullet. I would concede that perhaps it helps some people more than others -- those with poorer body position or that are tall/overweight. There also seems to be a school of thought that the B70 is most helpful for breaststroke.
Here's the most contentious recent thread: Ban the tech suits? - U.S. Masters Swimming Discussion Forums
Dolphin 2 also started his own thread: Use of Paddles & Flippers vs Tech Suits. Since Dolphin 2 only posts on tech suits, I'm beginning to think he's an alias for one of those "highly respected" USMS types to which you refer. Just can't believe a non-swimmer would bother with a swim forum.
As far as the legality of the suit is concerned, I do not believe the suits physical properties will allow a person to swim 3 seconds faster per 50. Even 5-7 tenth of a seconds seems like a stretch. I believe the drops in time can be more directly linked to the psychological advantage it produces. I know I feel super human in a speed suit and I certainly feel a larger surge of adrenaline and confidence then without one. I do believe the physical properties help But, like I said I believe it to be more physiological than anything. It would be interesting to put olympic level swimmers in a disguised LZR suit and tell them its a new type of drag suit for practice and they should see much slower results while wearing it. Let them race and see if it effects their time. Never underestimate the power of the mind.
I do believe the suits are faster but three seconds per 50 is a little much from my experience. I say on average about .75 sec. in a 50, 1.00 to 1.50 in a 100 and 2.50 to 3.50 in a 200. We can go round and round on this one just my own experience.
My math must be wrong here.
So w/ a B70 I should be going a :21 in the 50 FR (from my :24); a :23 in my 50 fly (from my 26); and around 99 seconds faster in my 1650 putting me around a 16:16. I want my money back b/c I'm not going NEAR those times in my B70! :bitching:
In practice I dropped about 10 seconds/100m switching from a Speedo "lapswim" suit to a Speedo competition/training suit. The old suit simply was not designed for "performance". It was the best suit in my size at the time.
From coaches I've heard that the swimmers who benefit the most from technical suits will be the slower ones with the worst technique or body shape or conditioning. Given that, I have to believe that a technical suit would give me some fairly good time drops. But I don't believe I could find one to fit even if I decided I wanted to buy one.
I guess my stroke technique must need a lot of work then!
Like anyone here, I can only relate my experience and I dropped 3 seconds in a 50.
Last year Roque also told me that many swimmers did test sets of 50s with a "regular suit" and then put on the B70 and also dropped, on average, 3 seconds per 50. I didn't believe him. I do now.
Last summer I personally watched a 15 year old do a 1:07 in trials for a 100 fly (no holding back), put on a B70 and go 1:01 in the finals. That, too, works out to 3 seconds per 50.
Anyhow, I'm not trying to start a debate about how much time will be dropped, however I would like to know if it's feasible to have a B70 division, as it is almost a wetsuit?
And does anyone think it will be banned the end of this summer?
