Today, for whatever reason, I made a focused effort to sight the end of the pool, albeit momentarily, during my breath. I think it helped me keep correct orientation and pitch thus helping my body dolphin. I think before I was just looking cross eyed into the water ahead and not really picking the end of the pool as the focus. It was cool seeing the wall "rapidly" approaching.
So my question is, should you not look at any discernable thing and zone out looking for the tee, or should you take a conscious peek at the wall on every breath to help keep body orientation?
What say you?
Former Member
Well, hell has frozen over. I'm going to agree with Michael for the first time ever. :) I never look at the other end of the pool. I might, maybe, roll my eyeballs up once (but not while breathing) about 4-5 strokes from the wall, but that's it. Or, at least that's what I aim to do.
Maybe I need to not look forward too then.
Anyone want to desribe their had/arm entry. I think I'm pressing down on the water and it's aggravating my shoulder.
doesn't matter, you don't need to orient yourself in fly by spotting any object other than the wall for turns and touches.
You should train so you automatically swim correct fly.
Today, for whatever reason, I made a focused effort to sight the end of the pool, albeit momentarily, during my breath. I think it helped me keep correct orientation and pitch thus helping my body dolphin. I think before I was just looking cross eyed into the water ahead and not really picking the end of the pool as the focus. It was cool seeing the wall "rapidly" approaching.
So my question is, should you not look at any discernable thing and zone out looking for the tee, or should you take a conscious peek at the wall on every breath to help keep body orientation?
What say you?
Oddly enough, I have never had any shoulder problems with butterfly. Perhaps it is the shared stresses that alleviate any injuries, both arms working at once.
The entry is with hands about shoulder width with the hands relaxed and thumbs a little down (lower than the rest of the hand, not more than that). Scull out, keeping elbows high and try to press the chest down, as if diving into the stroke. When the hands are in plane with the elbows and shoulders, the thumbs should be pointing at each other and about shoulder width again. Make any sense?
Maybe I need to not look forward too then.
Anyone want to desribe their had/arm entry. I think I'm pressing down on the water and it's aggravating my shoulder.
Best advice I ever got was from a Kerry O'Brien clinic, although I think Dennis Baker says about the same thing at his. Kerry's mantra for the entry is "soft hands". Being new to fly and a rather typical male dork, I tend to tense up and try to muscle the whole pull/recovery cycle, which invariably ends in disaster. Thinking "Soft hands" helps me to avoid that flailing feeling. If you watch Phelps swim, his hands look completely relaxed during the recovery phase. Just settle those hands on top of the water, and let them float down until you start the catch. I think the undulation/kick is providing all of the forward momentum at this point.
Yes. I think I'll have to drill this a bit to build it it. I think I'm doing a bit of a "massive" row from near the top of the water--so there is pressue on the down ward movement. I'll drive my hand down a bit more on entry, and see if it works. The thumb down may be the trick.
I think the ache s a symptomn of freestyle aggravation (which I mostly have corrected) and it now gets is susceptible and easily bothered by fly.
Just testing my multi-quote capabilities here.
Oddly enough, I have never had any shoulder problems with butterfly. Perhaps it is the shared stresses that alleviate any injuries, both arms working at once.
The entry is with hands about shoulder width with the hands relaxed and thumbs a little down (lower than the rest of the hand, not more than that). Scull out, keeping elbows high and try to press the chest down, as if diving into the stroke. When the hands are in plane with the elbows and shoulders, the thumbs should be pointing at each other and about shoulder width again. Make any sense?
Yes. I think I'll have to drill this a bit to build it it. I think I'm doing a bit of a "massive" row from near the top of the water--so there is pressue on the down ward movement. I'll drive my hand down a bit more on entry, and see if it works. The thumb down may be the trick.
I think the ache s a symptomn of freestyle aggravation (which I mostly have corrected) and it now gets is susceptible and easily bothered by fly.
And the one thing that surprised me was that Phelps breathes every stroke, unlike advice given to so many who swim fly. I wonder what a lot of you think about that. He was amazing to watch at the Olympics.
Donna
He does it because his position in the water is so correct that he can easily breathe every stroke because there is no difference in the level of effort to take a breath versus not. Unlike the rest of us mere mortals. :bow: :bow: :bow: :bow:
And the one thing that surprised me was that Phelps breathes every stroke, unlike advice given to so many who swim fly. I wonder what a lot of you think about that. He was amazing to watch at the Olympics.
Donna
I'm slow but I do best breathing every stroke. I find that my arms drag on the recovery if I don't breathe due to shoulder stiffness. I greatly prefer having the extra air. Butterfly is much easier when I keep my chin in the water and my head in a relaxed neutral position instead of lifting and jutting it forward when breathing. I don't breathe well when my neck is hyperextended, and it tired my upper back too much with no benefit. Another thing I changed was to press the chest down when "landing" from the recovery but to keep the hands closer to the surface on entry. Finally, I learned how to use the lats more and triceps less.
OK, I watched all the olympic fly races again and they all noticeably lift their heads to breathe and look virtually straight ahead momentarily before bringing it back down in alignment with their spine.
Whether or not they focus on the wall is up for debate, but they certainly could if they wanted.
I definately don't want to lift my head too much. Just don't know if I should focus on "nothing" when my head is out of the water.
IMO Phelps is looking at the wall ahead, but I think he has an "experts" only head position.
And the one thing that surprised me was that Phelps breathes every stroke, unlike advice given to so many who swim fly. I wonder what a lot of you think about that. He was amazing to watch at the Olympics.
Donna
I received Phelps' book "No Limits - The Will To Succeed" as a Christmas gift. It's light reading but I enjoyed it. Anyway, he mentioned that he works on keeping his chin down in fly when he breathes. So he might be looking at the wall, but he's not raising his head any higher than it needs to be to breathe.
