LD16 allowing wetsuits in all USMS sanctioned events

I say let them wear wetsuits. But make them wear flowered caps. Life is full of tradeoffs.

its not a defense. pool racing at every level is now a gear sport. open water is at a crossroad, blue seventy has now gotten fina approval for some of their wetsuits. once the pros start wearing them, its all over. the olympic 10k was held in a rowing basin (not what i would call open water). i understand the need to make it friendly for spectators etc, but take away the waves, wind, current, jellies, exposure???? why not just cover it over so we don't get the sun in our eyes and remove any offensive flora and fauna and chlorinate it and put lines on the bottom to follow and..............(see paragraph 1) Is open water swimming really about being forced to experience extreme tempertures or jellyfish stings? It seems like it would be more about swimming performance under waves/wind/current. Most OW events seem to be scheduled during the summer, so I can hardly imagine that temperature was supposed to be a factor for OW events. I haven't yet competed OW, so I am less experienced here, you tell me. Eventually you have to decide what is reasonable and what is not. If wetsuits are taking the "nature" out of the event, then why allow goggles or any swimsuit at all? Ultimately there is some rational level of comfort afforded to competitors so they can focus on the the point of the competition. If temperature and possible jellyfish stings are a distinct part of OW swimming, then I say no wetsuits, if however OW events are not defined as overcoming those elements, then who cares, focus on the event, not the circumstances.

As I read this forum, it seems like a lot of people need to disparage the use of wetsuits to make themselves feel better about themselves. You know, like the high school kid who has low self-esteem so he makes fun of another kid to make himself feel better. Why the hell should you care if other people like and use wetsuits? That's worrying about stuff that you can't really control and which is none of your business. As long as it doesn't affect you--and it doesn't if there's a separate category for wetsuits--ignore it. Now if these wetsuit people were swimming against people without and taking their awards, that would be a different story.

Is open water swimming really about being forced to experience extreme tempertures or jellyfish stings? QUOTE] first off, no one is forcing anyone to do anything they are not comfortable doing.....period. this proposed rule change would "force" event organizers to maintain a separate division for all catagories for wetsuit wearers if they are to run a usms sanctioned event. as i mentioned before; i have never attended an event where anyone was refused the right to participate because he/she wanted to wear a wetsuit. some events are about overcoming adverse conditions and some are not. the ederle swim is a 16 mile event being held oct 25 from lower manhattan to sandy hook nj. no wetsuits. no fastskins. no neoprene caps.... likewise for the english channel, the manhattan marathon, the catalina channel etc.

Perhaps something could be done to address all of that water in the open water events. Might make them more appealing.

As I read this forum, it seems like a lot of people need to disparage the use of wetsuits to make themselves feel better about themselves. You know, like the high school kid who has low self-esteem so he makes fun of another kid to make himself feel better. Why the hell should you care if other people like and use wetsuits? That's worrying about stuff that you can't really control and which is none of your business. As long as it doesn't affect you--and it doesn't if there's a separate category for wetsuits--ignore it. Now if these wetsuit people were swimming against people without and taking their awards, that would be a different story. regarding paragraph 1: you're missing the point, kind of like the highschool kid who hands his math homework to his english teacher. regarding paragraph 2: i don't care if people wear wetsuits. i do care about how requiring separate divisions might effect the way events are promoted and run.

I think a lot of people just need a frame of reference for what cold actually is and what your body can endure. I did a swim this month where the water was a balmy 66 degrees and I was pretty frosty for about a minute and a half and then it was basically a non issue. A lot of people just build it up to be epically cold in their heads and never bother to try swimming without a suit even though they totally could. Whenever I start thinking something is too cold I reflect on the dumbest thing I've ever done aquatically... on January 1st, 1996 I was living in Milwaukee and I found my way into Lake Michigan. I don't know how cold the water was that day but there were chunks of ice meandering about. The water was shockingly cold and then proceeded to burn, kinda weird. So whenever I feel like it's too cold to swim in the ocean, or a pool isn't warm enough I think about polar bearing in Wisconsin and I get over it pretty quickly. If you're going to wear a wetsuit you're going to wear a wetsuit... it is what it is and I'll gladly compete beside you. But I think people on the fence about it should try an open water swim without one at least once, you might realize it's not that bad after all.

btw, i'm not yelling I think most "OW purists" would disagree with you. If they allowed wetsuits but not in a separate division, then OW champs risk becoming like the Chesapeake Bay swim, where the majority where wetsuits. Even those who dislike them might feel compelled to wear them to be competitive. I bet such a proposal would have a hard time passing. I prefer the Big Shoulders model, myself. as i have stated: i have never been to an event where wetsuits were not allowed except for a couple that function by channel rules. Your prediction about what event directors would do sounds bizarre to me. The only thing the proposal requires is that, IF awards are given to wetsuit-wearers, it shall be in a separate category. my response was to the poll answer #1 awards to all divisions Why would this affect insurance or the decision to seek USMS sanction? many ow event organizers do not seek usms sanctions now. this would do nothing to encourage them to do so in the future. Sorry to repeat myself...all of this is allowed RIGHT NOW at all OW meets except national championships. All the proposal does is erase that distinction. I fail to see how the world will stop rotating on its axis as a result. One may then argue, of course, that the proposal won't do much because its scope is fairly limited. I agree that, alone, it won't have much effect. It has to be accompanied by an effort to actually invite a broader community to OW races.i think if one wants to seriously promote open water swimming, one should also have a "supply side" effort....organized training IN open water, rather than just make the competition end cozier. For me, ultimately, it depends on what we want USMS to be. I have always viewed us as promoting (competitive) swimming to people of a broad range of abilities and background. I think this proposal furthers that goal and is in line with the Rob Butcher's "Vision and Action Plan." i agree that event organizers should (and for the most part do) promote openwater swimming to more than the competitive, and the proposal that allows usas swimmers to be on the course at the same time as usms is a good one. the addition of non-usms waves is becoming more popular as well. it takes a lot to put on an ow event and it just makes sense to offer as many people the chance to swim the course as possible.

first off, no one is forcing anyone to do anything they are not comfortable doing.....period. this proposed rule change would "force" event organizers to maintain a separate division for all catagories for wetsuit wearers if they are to run a usms sanctioned event. as i mentioned before; i have never attended an event where anyone was refused the right to participate because he/she wanted to wear a wetsuit. some events are about overcoming adverse conditions and some are not. the ederle swim is a 16 mile event being held oct 25 from lower manhattan to sandy hook nj. no wetsuits. no fastskins. no neoprene caps.... likewise for the english channel, the manhattan marathon, the catalina channel etc. While no one is "forced", I thought the prior rules essentially made wetsuit wearers be ineligible for awards. This essentially "forces" you to not wear one if you wish to compete for awards. (If am wrong on the prior rules, I apologize, please correct me.) I probably would never enter a competition where I didn't have a chance at winning something. I can understand it may be harder to plan events, ultimately each event planner should be able to dictate wetsuit/non-wetsuit or blended event. Supporting more swimmers of all types will get them more registrations anyway and that should be worth the extra overhead for planning. I dont think event directors should be forced to suddenly double the amount of events and I agree its not a level playing field for awards to be shared between the two types of swimmer. Having awards for wetsuit and non-wetsuit is just the only fair way to allow wetsuit swimmers to actually compete for awards without giving them an advantage over those that dont wear them. I was mostly responding to the antagonism there seems to be that wearing a wetsuit is somehow not experiencing nature and that roughing the harsh temps and jellyfish is somehow a required part of the "real" sport.

i have never been to an event where wetsuits were not allowed except for a couple that function by channel rules. I have. The Chris Green Lake swims -- site of several previous OW national championships -- never allow wetsuits, period. I also agree with dwlovell that "allowing" wetsuits but making them ineligible for awards -- and in some cases not even listing them in results as finishers -- pretty strongly discourages the practice and is only "allowing" them to wear wetsuits in the broadest sense. many ow event organizers do not seek usms sanctions now. this would do nothing to encourage them to do so in the future. Okay. Why is that? Sounds like a separate problem. i think if one wants to seriously promote open water swimming, one should also have a "supply side" effort....organized training IN open water, rather than just make the competition end cozier. There we go with the macho thing again...OW diehards just can't seem to help themselves... :) Sure, providing organized OW practices is a nice thing to do. But the local Richmond triathletes do significantly more OW training than I do, with organized river swims every two weeks (I trained exactly once in the river this summer, though I swam in 3 OW races). Yet they still prefer wear their wetsuits in OW races. Why wouldn't they? That's how they race in triathlons, after all. Sure some of them are weak swimmers but most would do just fine without wetsuits, they just prefer to wear them and don't really care what any OW purist thinks about it.