So after all the endless discussions on this topic....and the challenge in trying to "coach" in writing I actually found myself helping out a local pro triathlete last week with just this thing.
As is the case on this forum and other times I've attempted to explain; catch, rotation, lengthening of stroke, maintaining stroke while accelerating, etc. I found again that some folks have a "natural" sense of feel for this stuff....its VERY hard to coach feel.
So.....I spent yesterday breaking down my stroke wit assistance from Jane Scott (Boulder Coach) and trying to better explain what it is I do unconsciously that others have to think about...some observations:
- In a series of 25's (all from a push) I tasked myself with keeping 11 strokes per lap and to descend each 25 till I added a stroke.....my goal to see what changed.
- First observation....I can literally slip my hand/forearm/arm thru the water without feeling any sense of "pressure" and take 11 strokes as slow as 25 seconds.....I can accelerate and descend down to 12+ keeping the same 11 strokes....faster than that my kick "kicks in" and I add another stroke and get to the low 11 range.
- What was different? First thing I noticed is that although it seems my hand track stayed the same on each 25 there was an ever increasing sense of "pressure" I could feel as I got faster. I would equate the sensation change as dramatic as moving my hand thru air on the easiest 25 to literally feeling the sensation I would feel pushing on the wall to climb out of the pool.
- So what happened? First I was able to discern a "tensioning" of my arm...but further examining this with Janes help it became apparent that this "coiling like a spring" as she described it was coming from my core....very interesting to really focus on this and realize how much that changed everything.....from there it extended to my catch....and ultimately the entire stroke movement thru the water.
- What next? We asked a few other swimmers to work on this as well and t change their focus to their core and it was amazing that all of them said the same thing....they could not feel anything in that area...when we asked to try and tense it resulted in other parts of the stroke falling apart...
- Thoughts for now; I really do think that to change these things takes an incredible amount of breaking down the stroke via drill work as has been discussed over and over here...the difference is really taking the time to think specifically how these drills translate to actually swimming...so many people I see do drills without a real sense of their purpose.
I think the key drills for me at this stage continue to be variations of sculling, the "arrow" drill shown on a link in an earlier thread that U of A uses and head of swimming (tarzan).
So....my coffee has run out and I have bloviated enough for now....very interesting for me however!
Former Member
I loved watching Laure Manadou's 400 free; it sure brings back memories. I have always been a 2-beat kicker in free, but 6-beat in backstroke. A couple of things I noticed in that video was, as someone else noticed, she really kicked off those turns and then got into the 2-beat kick and "her" swim rhythm. This is partly what I have said a few times in the past that a person needs to develop their own swim style within the guidelines of correct swimming. I would venture to bet that if she went to a multi-beat kick, she'd lose her rhythm and not swim as well because her body has figured out this works for her. And I did notice she breathed more than the girl that was pushing her; ah, the benefits of oxygen.
So it is apparent that a swimmer can be great with or without a lot of kicking; at least at that distance. Her catch and grab was terrific.
I think I need to make that choice to be one of the 2%. Up until Worlds last year, my goals had been primarily fitness related. I used my times as just fitness bench marks. An example is my LCM 200 free. I went from 2:33 in 2005 to 2:12 at worlds in 2006. The bulk of that drop is directly attributed to losing about 35 pounds and increasing my fitness level. Since then I've been a bit ruderless in the pool thinking about maintaining wieght and fitness rather than swimming faster.
So this thread has me inspired to focus on technique in order to swim faster. DPS, Starts,turns, SDK's and breath control are all things I have ignored up until now. And if you've seen me swim it shows. What time improvements can be gained in these areas, only time will tell. But I do have to mentally commit to these things in order to improve them.
Kevin
Kevin,
That's an impressive time drop! You should be very proud of that! There is no limit to what you could do if you team technique work with what you have been doing already! Set your goals, take time to work on technique and stay consistent...there will be no limit to what you could achieve.
This morning myself, my wife Laura, Rich Abrahams, Susan Von der Lippe & Sheri Hart went to do video analysis at a new facility a friend of ours just opened up (Swim Labs; has 3 endless pools w/video).....some very interesting stuff to say the least.....especially when we used th side by side video comparisons.....I'll download soon on YouTube and provide a link.
In the meantime....a lot of people may not have ever seen this clip of Fast Freddy going 18.74 in the 50 free.....the most impressive combination of speed, power, spl, dps, kick I've ever seen......
www.youtube.com/watch
For the 2% of us who want to compete and get faster its a different story....unless we all take the time address technique we'll see a much more rapid decline of our times as we age up....the scary thing is having a guy like Mr. Abraham's working on getting better....is anyone else afraid!
I think I need to make that choice to be one of the 2%. Up until Worlds last year, my goals had been primarily fitness related. I used my times as just fitness bench marks. An example is my LCM 200 free. I went from 2:33 in 2005 to 2:12 at worlds in 2006. The bulk of that drop is directly attributed to losing about 35 pounds and increasing my fitness level. Since then I've been a bit ruderless in the pool thinking about maintaining wieght and fitness rather than swimming faster.
So this thread has me inspired to focus on technique in order to swim faster. DPS, Starts,turns, SDK's and breath control are all things I have ignored up until now. And if you've seen me swim it shows. What time improvements can be gained in these areas, only time will tell. But I do have to mentally commit to these things in order to improve them.
Kevin
Ok, I have to admit that when our coach calls for DPS or stroke counting during a set, I fake it. Why, it is usually at slower intervals and it seems like it just too easy to cheat with out getting any real benefits.
Kevin....you ad 99% of most swimmers I would estimate. Hey its in our nature to "grind" out the yardage and get out of the pool with that totally wasted sensation that we get addicted to.
And for the 98% of masters swimmers that may be all they are ever interested in and they'll avoid the hard work it takes to back off....slow down and work on stroke technique.
For the 2% of us who want to compete and get faster its a different story....unless we all take the time address technique we'll see a much more rapid decline of our times as we age up....the scary thing is having a guy like Mr. Abraham's working on getting better....is anyone else afraid!
PS: the absolute hardest workouts I do are focused drill days.....tons of sculling/dps work integrated w/breath control, descending speed sets w/spl focus, etc. etc. It's a different kind of pain.....and then mental fatigue often exceeds the physical!
I could watch Michael Jordan dunk as many times as I wished, and study slo-mo video of how he jumps and do any number of drills - or weight training, or plyometrics. I'd still never dunk.
Terry, Did you try lowering the basket? I find that helps my dunking abilities tremendously :joker:
Great OW article in USMS Swimmer, btw. Interesting stuff, plus great picture of Barra.
More on topic, we did some Stroke Per Lenth counting last night, a set with longer pulls followed by 50s. I have been trying to shy away from these drills to keep the arm speed up, but was noticing throughout the set that there wasn't much of a difference in the number as I tried to work my arms faster. I guess somehow throughout the practice, I came to some sort of happy medium of long strokes with faster moving arms.
Its kinda strange that Freddy actually looked a little behind lane 2 and maybe even lane 1....(if Freddy was in lane 3 that is and not lane 6...if so then convert appropriately) ....yet after the turn he popped up first and then just opened up the nitrous tank and flew.....Different than the video of Crocker's 100 free where Crocker clearly pops up last on the start and all turns.....and is clearly out in front even from the start. I would love to see a 50 free race between Freddy and Crocker ...it would be interesting to see the 2 different styles side by side....but one thing they both have in common is their DPS and SPL...although I bet Crocker's SPL is lower because he seems to go farther underwater.
Newmastersswimmer
Its my pleasure Poolraat,
click here for head-up swimming so called 'tarzan drill'.
Hi
Here's a 13 minute Video of Popov during which he does a Tarzan stroke (amongst other things).
swimmingscience.blogspot.com/.../alexander-popov.html
Cheers
George....they do.....www.swimlabs.com
Quite an interesting session with Rich Abrahams, Sheri Hart, Susan Von der Lippe, myself and my wife Laura....
Its been sometime since I was in an endless pool.....and I've never been taped in one.....overall it was vry helpful although I found swimming against the current vs. a pool changes my stroke a fair amount (on fly my entry/pull is much wider...I'm debating downloading the video to youtube.....we'll see!
