2 more universities ditch swimming

Dorothy: I'm so glad your son likes swimmer-girls! I have actually heard some teenage boys say they don't find female athletes attractive, particularly female swimmers with their big ole shoulders. Disgraceful. Unfortunately, I think Hoffam is right for another reason. "Rich and famous" and "on TV" seems to be the standard for sport popularity. Maybe Michael Phelps will help. Although I still see more girls reading his new book than boys.... I helped indoctrinate my boys about swimmer girls! I always liked them, even with broad shoulders. Not the 70s-era East Germans though. No muffin tops on the girls my boys seem to like..... I do think many girls like the looks of swimmer boys. They like lean bodies with broad shoulders and bleached out hair.

Jeff, Even though the AD claims that Title IX was a factor, Rutgers has never been close to having a Title IX problem. BTW the NCAA doesn't define compliance WRT Title IX. It is the federal government. Now, the NCAA is looking at graduation rates and penalizing those that are not making the grade by taking away scholarships, coaches, post-season appearances amoung other things. There was mention of "revenue sports". Be careful of how one uses the term. Revenue sports generate income but many do not generate a profit. I believe the Rutgers football team lost a million dollars last year. That amount is greater than the "savings" the dropped sports will provide. Leo

Are there really fewer male age group swimmers nowadays? The swim meets seem to be getting longer where I live... which suggests that enrollment is up. If you're right, it's because those boys are too busy playing the myriad team sports where by age 10 you must practice year round 24/7. Life is just not complete anymore unless you play travel soccer, from what I can tell.

In my experience, I definitely agree with GoodSmith or BadSmith above, I can never tell them apart. I do see more girls than boys at meets these days. I think where SmithAlpha or Beta and I disagree is in the "sky is falling" concern about US swimming. I will eventually go to a national meet and take my beating like the half man that I am. My last Nationals experience left me humbled and dejected. At least I now know what I'm up against and can prepare better.

Geek: You can always use my "it's too far to travel excuse" or my "I don't like 3 hour time changes" excuse. I agree that there are more girls than boys at meets especially in the younger age groups. But I still think interest is up in the sport where I live (outside DC). I had to wait 5 years to get into my own neighborhood summer league swim club! From my observations, if there are fewer boys, it is because boys in elementary school just don't like swimming very much. It's tedious. They swim up and down the lanes. It's mostly indoors. It requires hard work and inflicts pain. I've had many boys tell my 6th grade daughter that they just don't like USS swimming very much. They'd rather play travel soccer, the only sport that seems to matter here.

This game called soccer is very popular with the boys, or the boys around here anyway. But, let me tell you, you want to see some grumpy parents, ask a soccer parent about the time committment required. I think I'll shoot myself if soccer ever comes up at my house. I have a secret theory on soccer, which I will make public. Basically, all kids can run around in a pack and flail wildly at a ball, from day one. Swimming, like some other skill based sports, requires a good deal of practice. You can't just jump in and go for it, unlike soccer. Now, before all the mini van drivin' crazy soccer moms start getting on my case, I'm only talking about base skill, not advanced skills. I realize it takes a lot of work to be good at soccer, but not as much as is required with swimming, sorry.

I am, whoops WAS, a travel soccer parent. But I refuse to drive a mini-van. There are some parents that grumble about the time commitment. I wasn't particularly fond of it myself. But, in my experience, I have found parents love travel soccer, they clamor around to get their kids on the best teams even if they have to drive forever. They know every team's record, how many goals have been scored against them the last calendar year and the team's national ranking. (I ask you, how can you meaningfully rank a soccer team with 10-11 year old girls?!). But to be good at soccer, you do have to practice a lot. The girls on my daughter's FORMER team are up to 4-5 practices a week and mandatory away camps in the summer. They now have mandatory Sat. morning video sessions where they review tapes and talk strategy. Daily juggling is not negotiable. I could go on. Suffice it to say, this year we reached the breaking point and my daughter picked swimming. My younger daughter will never play travel soccer as a result of the torture inflicted on me from that sport. I'm sure I'll be in trouble with other soccer moms too.

Geek, I keep tellin' yah.... mens swimming in the US is under attack all the way from the youngest age groupers to the NCAA level. Enrollment is not impressive for males at all levels (especially when compared to the overall population growth since 1970s when you and I grew up). Here's a couple more programs shot out of the sky. Hell, the Big 12 is a joke at the conference meet each year. There's only a few teams left participating. I find it interesting how the US prides itself every 4 years on the total gold medal count at the Games. Swimming consistently wins more medals than other sports. Yet we have little interest in funding it compared to the Big 3. John Smith

Geek and I have argued this point. It may be a regional phenomenon. Here in Colorado the ratio of boys to girls in most of the events can be very lop sided. Sometimes there are as many as 30% more girls in a single event compared to boys. Geek denies there's any problem. Then again, Geek won't come to USMS nationals and face Paul and I for a man to man, beer to beer argument. John Smith

I get it and don't get it. The schools must have swim facilities a capitol investment. They must have guards and a swim coach. I guess they will not dump all that ,there still will be swim classes and exercise. You must mean they will not support travel and expenses to swim meets with other schools to compete. I can understand that theres a lot of money on football /basketball in college sports because there are lots of sports gamblers and the media coverage is what generates the money. I understand that there are lots of people who watch televised sports that just love the game but to tell you the truth if it were not for sports gambling in all the ways it exists (football pools ect) there probably would be no great intrest in sports in this country after high school. Think of all the attention to beepers/cell phones/ ect that can provide game scores..like its a big deal. I could care less for all that but it is big in this country and lots of people have money riding on a game, thats why they watch and the media gives such attention. Swimming is not a betting sports game.. now think about that a minute and you know it could be except it would be a betting game that would be too easy to "throw" (payback to swim slow example) so there no betting intrest. Now to prove what I am saying look at this. Football stadiums are pretty full on game days, football is in a sense todays "Americas Sport" so there are today lots of people who enjoy a day at the stadium to cheer on the home team, ..basketball stadiums may look full but how many people do they actually hold.. the fans there are real and enjoy the game, but a much smaller crowd then the football stadium..I mean how big is a basketball court in size? And a coiuple thousand people there will look huge on TV. Now the baseball stadium is big like a football stadium and look at the games on TV and... see a few people there..lots of empty seats, thats ok..the gamblers can still get their scores from the web/TV / radio ect..and thats where the money is. Now maybe you can understand why some colleges are dropping swimming as a team sport. No sports gambler intrest.. no media coverage.. no money to be made. Hey .. maybe theres a way to turn that around.... Lane 1 is off a tenth lane two is closing, lane 6 is ...just like the horse races.. cept like I said, Its too easy to "throw".. but keep thinking..theres got to be a way.