Does anyone else here NOT kick when they swim freestyle?
When I was 19, a coach told me that a lot of "real" freestylers don't kick, which was a surprise to me because every other coach I'd had would yell at me to kick during my events. I grew up thinking I was the odd one out, but maybe someone on here knows what I'm talking about...
Former Member
Others might find adequate balance without their kick and have a pull that reduces the need for a propulsive kick. I am a strong advocate of drilling freestyle no kick with a band around the ankles. I have never met one single swimmer capable of performing this drill at reasonable speed without a negative impact on lower body position on the water. Of course this drill is aimed at improving one's ability to be in balance without the help of the kick, but even when performed by international level freestyle specialists, there is always some level of lowerbody sinking.
As is with most things regarding people there is no cookie cutter, one size fits all answer or solution.
Couldn't agree more.
Unless you're trying to sell books, of course.
Couldn't agree more.
Unless you're trying to sell books, of course. I have nothing to sell don't worry.
And to tell you the truth, I have nothing against those who do, unless they're selling wrong information... if you know what I mean ;)
This goes back to my original question of how do you improve your kick?
I have always had a weak kick. For the past few years I have been kicking with fins (Kiefer silicone training fins, slightly longer and more flexible than Zoomers). I began with a basic set like 10x50s on 1:00, but have also done sets of 100s, as well as vertical kicking (initially with fins, now without). I improved to the point that I could do a set of 50s on :45 holding :35. Training with the age groupers, we did sets of swimming with fins, usually longer repeats on fast intervals (very tiring). It seems to have helped--recently I discovered that I am now able to kick 50s without fins on 1:00--something I couldn't do when I was younger.
Free kick seems to tire me out even more than fly kick so i've kind of avoided it at all costs :o thinking 'why bother, it won't do me any good'...but based on your experience, i think i'm going to need t do with free kick like i did with fly kick - start building in sets of free kick with fins into every workout. :eek:!
Ankle 'floppyness' and flexibility are very important too.
Here my big toe touches the ground while having my leg entirely flat on the ground..
www.dropshots.com/day.php
As a result of a good ankle flexibility and floppyness, I am not putting any effort whatsoever in this kicking demo here..
www.dropshots.com/day.php
...did your freestyle times improve when your kicking times improved?
My times improved, but I don't know how much of that was due to the kicking. I swim middle distance with a two- or four-beat kick.
So here's a purely personal and highly empirical take on kicking: The pull and kick do not function independently in any stroke. Instead, they’re interwoven in a complex whole-body dynamic. In my freestyle, I can feel very clearly that the primary function of my kick is not to propel me forward, but to help my body rotate. When I kick DOWN with my left leg, it drives my left hip UP and my right hand FORWARD, which contributes to the power of the right hip and shoulder driving DOWN. And it’s this combination which “vaults” me past the spot where my left hand is holding onto the water. And if I was to tie your ankles together, thus preventing you from using your kick, without using any pull buoy, what consequence(s) would it have during let's say a 1500 free style event? Just to clarify the context or this hypotetical experiment, you swim (or try to swim) your best 1500 even with no kick and no buoyancy aid.
Because swimmers always move faster when using the arms alone, than with legs alone, Doc compared the pull and kick to a car with separate front-wheel and rear-wheel drive. If the front wheels turn at 30 mph, but the rear wheels turn at 20 mph, the resultant speed will not be 50 but less than 30, because the rear wheels create drag. The same thing happens when a swimmer overemphasizes the kick. The kick consumes energy and increases drag.
There is a problem with this analogy. The wheels of the car are turning at a constant speed, but a swimmer has periods of acceleration and deceleration during each stroke cycle.
Clearly there are many swimmers with a very propulsive kick, Popov being a good example (able to kick 50m in 28 seconds). As for distance swimmers, Bill Rose has stated that a six beat kick was an essential part of Lars Jensen's success in the 1500 in Athens.
Many coaches (Maglischo among them) believe that the primary function of a nonpropulsive kick is to provide balance. Supporting this view is the example of a swimmer with a relatively weak kick who is faster with a pull buoy than full stroke swimming. Presumably hip rotation is no better (and possibly worse) with a pull buoy than without.
I have heard it said (Rick DeMont?) that you should build your stroke around your strengths; specifically, if you have a propulsive kick, by all means build the stroke around it.
My response to this:
As is with most things regarding people there is no cookie cutter, one size fits all answer or solution.
was: "Couldn't agree more, unless you're trying to sell books, of course."
I was not referring specifically to totalswimm in this post. This is a common approach which appeals to a lot of people and does sell a lot of books (self help, weight loss, sports, parenting, you name it).
But neither was I excluding totalswimm.
As for this: "Inferring that my motivation in contributing to this forum is to sell books...", I don't recall posting anything to that effect. However, I think it's safe to assume that totalswimm may see this forum as an opportunity to promote TI among Masters swimmers. Not that there's anything wrong with that.
