Winter Olympics as a game of chance

I too wonder if they would finished their program.They did, Pairs skating is sometimes very dangerious. Its the most dangerious event of figure skating because of the throws and a quad throw at that. Also, sometimes the partners accidently drop their partners when the do lifts.

Who would have wagered that the Canadian men's hockey team ( wait a minute, that's a oxymoron ) would finish out of medal round and get shut out in 3 games? Guess they left Turin under a shroud of controversy...........sorry couldn't resist. Go Suomi Go!!!

Originally posted by Matt S Anyone checked out how the Pistons are playing in the NBA lately, with no legit superstars? How many rings does Iverson have? Oh, BTW, when was the last time the Yankees won the Series; it's been so long that I forget. OK, Matt, I'll agree with you on hockey but you have absolutely no clue whatsoever on the NBA or MLB. First, the Yankess are probably the greatest sports franchise of all time. The only other teams that even come close to their dominance are the 60s Celtics (loaded with talent) and the great college teams of UCLA (also loaded with talent). Second, even though it's been a few years since they won it all, they compete for it every year, usually up to the ALCS. Lasty, name the last small market, low salary MLB team to win the series. Big money and big talent win in MLB, it's been that way for 100 years. Allen Iverson has single handedly pushed the 76ers well beyond what they were capable on their own. Anyone with a shred of basketball knowledge recognizes this. Sure he's brash but he's also one of the greatest and most durable point guards in the history of the NBA. Pistons - no legit superstars? Do you watch the NBA? The had 4 of the 12 EC All Star game spots. The Pistons have probably the most loaded across the board superstars in the league. Ben Wallace and Rasheed Wallace are among the most recognizeable and popular players in the league. Most teams would trade their top two players for Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton (except the Heat, of course). Stick to hockey and swimming in your analyses.

The year the Red Sox won the World Series, they had the second highest payroll in the MLB. The White Sox had the 13th highest payroll last year. The Yankees payroll is staggering but they get the return on that. As to Rasheed, this is a swim forum, but suffice it to say anyone who knows a thing about the NBA knows that Rasheed is not an underachiever and has changed the definition of a power forward. ESPN actually had some graphics last week about his impact on the Pistons. It was very revealing. You claim you could take a team of roll players and beat a dream team. There hasn't been a team like that to win the WS, the NCAA tourney, the BCS series, NCAA swim championships, NCAA soccer, etc, in years and years. Maybe in HS you can have roll players win but no longer in college and pros. Those days are long over.

Originally posted by Matt S 2) NHL players in the Winter Olympics. OK, can we now all come to consensus that this is a BAD idea? How many times do we need to have it beaten in our heads that TEAMS that play together for months ahead of time will consistently beat All-Star squads tossed together at the last minute. I hate to tell you this, but Sweden won the gold and nearly all their team plays in the NHL. Their big stars are all NHL players (Sundin, Lidstrom, Forsberg).

Aquageek, OK, you got me on the Yankees. I would point out two things. Short of swimming, baseball is the sport with the least teamwork between the players (yeah, yeah, battery-mates, double-play combinations, hit & run, sacrifice bunting, etc. etc. It still can't hold a candle to the intricate teamwork of football, basketball, hockey, soccer, etc. etc.) and that is best suited for throwing together a pack of all-stars. Also, the Yankees may sign away all the most highly regarded players, but then they have the same spring training and 162 game season as everyone else does to play as a team. When you put talent and teamwork together, well you get the Yankees. But please note that even the Yankees with an unlimited payroll still don't always guess right as to who the best players will be, and that leaves a door open for a cohesive team like the White Sox or the Red Sox recently. Regarding the NBA, don't get me wrong. I have great respect for Iverson's skills and I think he is a future Hall of Famer. Also, the Pistons are my favorite team, to the extent I follow the dull as dirt NBA. However, I don't see any future HoFers on the current Piston team. Rasheed Wallace? The malcontent under-achiever the Trailbrazers couldn't unload fast enough? He has played great in the Piston's system, but that is my point exactly. It's the system, not marquee, future HoF guys that win championships. The Wallaces, Rip Hamilton and Chauncey Billips are terrific players, but no one is going to confuse them with Iverson, Karl Malone, John Stockton or Charles Barkley in their prime, and BTW, how many rings to those four distinguished players have? So, back to my main point. You can't evaluate team sports with a rotissery league mindset. "Dream Teams" are more illusion than reality. Give me a coach with a vision, and solid players that understand their rolls, and I'll embarass your all-stars more often than you would expect. There, this has been a fun, bar-stooling conversation. A pleasure chit-chatting with you. Matt

1) "Game of chance" Yes, that is why skiing and other winter sports are popular. You don't know who is going to win, miss a gate, or have a NASCAR'ish crack up. That is why people will freeze their you-know-whats off to watch the thing, while we swimmers have a hard time getting people to enjoy a taste of summer weather watching our meets. Their sport is compelling and watchable, whereas most knowledgable fans in our sport could fill out the order of finishers before the race with 90% accuracy. I'm a broken record on this subject, so I won't wax fulsome, but competitive swimming could use a little of the edginess of short track speed skating. Snowboard-cross! We need some of that there. 2) NHL players in the Winter Olympics. OK, can we now all come to consensus that this is a BAD idea? How many times do we need to have it beaten in our heads that TEAMS that play together for months ahead of time will consistently beat All-Star squads tossed together at the last minute. Did we learn nothing from Herb Brooks and the 1980 Olympic hockey competition? Has anyone checked which teams won the last few Superbowls and what was their concept? Any Randy Mosses, Terrel Owens, or Peyton Mannings in that crowd? No? Didn't think so. Anyone checked out how the Pistons are playing in the NBA lately, with no legit superstars? How many rings does Iverson have? Oh, BTW, when was the last time the Yankees won the Series; it's been so long that I forget. And don't get me started on the meager results the recent NBA "Dream Teams" have generated in international competition. The people who are dreaming are the chowder-heads that think you can slap together a group of supertalented individuals and expect them to beat a cohesive unit. So, tell the NHL to keep their players unless they are willing to skip the entire first part of the season up through the Olympics. (Besides, what effect does that really have on who makes the playoffs anyway?)

IMHO the poor performance by the US and Canadian hockey teams was compounded by the NHL work stoppage last year. Most US and Canadian born players did little on ice training, whereas many more of the European born players returned to their home country elite leagues and got reaquainted with playing on the bigger ice surface. It's easier to adapt to playing on a small NHL ice surface after playing most of your formative years on the larger Olympic size surface. In a swimming perspective one would find it much easier to adapt from long course metres to short course yards than vice versa.

I noticed the difference between the treastment of Sasha Cohen silver medalist in figure skating than swimmers. She has been able to appeared on talk shows like Leno and Regis and Kelly when they were recently in La,Jimmy Kimmel, and Ellen. Now, I have been aware of who she was for sometime and she has two world silver medals but when it was silver medal in the olympics, some appearances on national TV. A swimmer has to win a gold medal in the oympics to do this. Figure Skating is watch more by the general public also because of the ice shows which are entertaining.

Originally posted by cinc310 Now, I have been aware of who she was for sometime and she has two world silver medals but when it was silver medal in the olympics, some appearances on national TV. A swimmer has to win a gold medal in the oympics to do this. On the other hand, in figure skating there is exactly one gold medal awarded every four years for ladies singles. In swimming there are 25 Olympic golds by my count, including relays. Yeah, if you count pairs and ice dancing there are a total of 3 golds available to women in figure skating, but that's still a lot fewer than 25.