I submit that swimming is one of the worst sports in terms of following fad techniques simply because someone has been successful using that technique.
I submit that talent or genetics, aerobic capacity, workout intensity as well as mental toughness play a far greater roll than mere stroke technique in the end.
Seems like the US latches on to the winner's stroke techniques all too often as the way explain success and teach kids. Front quadrant swimming like Ian Thorpe..... head down sprinting like Popoff..... these guys would be successful in their events with or without these techniques in my opinion.
Except for the latest cheating techniques...... i.e. flip turns on backstroke, underwater dolphin kick on backstroke, head under on breastroke, full body suits, and the soon to be dolphin kick on breastroke pull outs, the sport has not improved a whole lot in the last 25 years.... especially when you compare it to 25 years previous to 1980..... (1955)
Thought for the day...... :-)
John Smith
I have yet to determine the point of this thread. Every sport goes through changes in training, techniques, equipment, etc. It's just part of sport or any activity, to be honest.
Allen may have a point. The use of goggles in the late 60s and early 70s may have been key to the huge advancements in world records times and training back then. Being able to stay in the water for twice as long or longer probably helped tremendously to change the sport.
I see a lot of people defending todays training techniques as the "right" way to swim. Might I point out that many collegiate athletes enter their Freshman year with insufficient "background" or yardage in their careers now. College coaches are finding they have to give them the background themselves. Are these reduced yardage careers being reduced too much ?
We are still a nation of few great milers. Maybe mega yardage is good only for the D-man as in the case of Brian Goodell and the "animal" lane at Mission Viejo in the 70s.
John Smith
Originally posted by Allen Stark
I take great issue with the idea technique isn't important,it's huge.Without good technique you don't have a chance. That said there hasn't really been a great technique change since the sixties except in breaststroke and there the rules changed (unless you count underwater dolphin.) Basically it's been "rotate more on free and back and keep your head down". Hardly an earth shaking break through. Front quadrant swimming is not new and is one of those ideas that only works for some swimmers at some distances. The arguement between lift versus drag propulsion has been facinating, but has had surprisingly little effect on how most elite swimmers swim.I think the biggest reaso times dropped so much in the late 60's and 70's is goggles. Until comfortable goggles came out yardage was limited by eye pain.
But how technique is explained and what is seen as proper technique has changed dramatically. Rotation is a major change in stroke construction. It used to be that no sprinter was to rotate, now many do. When & how you breath has changed very much, especially in distance swimming. I was watching a friend who used to swim in the seventies. He has just begun to swim again. His technique looks very odd. His head is high. His elbows are very bent throughout the stroke, almost going completely underneath him. His kick is very narrow and he never rotates. He was a better than average college swimmer thirty years ago.
The lift versus drag argument is fascinating. It amazes me that we still can't determine which of hte two really propels a swimmer forward. I bet that in time we will understand that both do. I think that they probably work together at different times inthe stroke.
I remember when I got my first pair of goggles. My father, who had been a swimmer in the 30s, said that they were too much of a nuisance to really be taken over by the everyday swimmer. Now even the slowest lap swimmer uses them. And look at other equipment we use. All of the training devises have really changed the way we spend time in the water. Many swimmers now use sometype of weighted devise when they are practicing. There was an article about them in Swimming Wrold. I've heard that one reason Shoeman is so strong is because he uses weighted buckets on a pulley system when he swimms. I remember when many people thought that using a stretch belt was a bad idea.
Some might ask what is a fad. I thnk that many everyday, common practices started as fads. This is especially true in sports. Look at West Coast Offense in football.
CraigIII
Do note that Shoeman's use of weighted buckets on pulleys is nothing revolutionary. Randy Reese implemented this particular training technique in the early 1980s. I used them a summer in 1983 when I swam for him in Gainesville at the Univ. of Florida.
Again... things go out of style.......... and back in style....... like a fad.
John Smith
Nothing faddish about this:
"This week’s Speedo Tip of the Week is an excerpt from the May-June 2005 issue of Splash, in which special correspondent Bonnie Moss writes about training with two-time Olympic medalist Erik Vendt. Here, Moss takes a look at some of Vendt’s favorite sets.
Training for Endurance
When training for the mile, endurance is key. Vendt uses endurance as his building blocks and also focuses on stroke work to help his 400 IM, the event in which he has won two Olympic silver medals. These days, he trains 50 percent endurance and 50 percent stroke work. He doesn’t want to give up too much distance training because that’s where he gets his strength for the back end of the IM.
Vendt says that in switching strokes in the IM, you need to have easy speed, great endurance and good racing sense. He likes to make his move towards the end of the race and prides himself on having the fastest last 200 in the world.
“I've always believed that if I was even with someone with a 100 to go, I would win,” Vendt says. “That sense of confidence comes from years of training endurance.”
Vendt’s favorite sets:
1.) 500 free @ 5:00 and 400 IM @ 5:00. Repeat the set five times, make the free interval, descend the IMs (Vendt went a 3:44 on the last 400 IM).
2.) 30 x 1000's @ 10:30 (Yes, you read that right). For the first 16 repeats, Vendt held his time under 10 minutes, but then fell apart physically and mentally. He found his way back, and on the last one, he went a 9:58.
“I like these sets because they're on opposite ends of the spectrum,” Vendt said. “One isn't so challenging, but you push yourself. The other is extremely challenging and shows you what you're made of. It shows you how far you can push your body because the set itself pushes you to the limit.”
Thanks! I will point out that although there were a total of 600 swimmers more than half swam the 2.5K. I was 4th out of 222 finishers in the 5K (w/o wetsuit). But, yes, I'm very happy with that!
This may be a little off the subject....but since (for the moment at least) we are talking about distance swimming, I want to congratulate you Kirk on an impressive showing last Saturday at the Chicago Big Shoulders 5K open water swim.....4th place out of 3 or 4 (or possibly 5?) hundred swimmers from all around the country aint too shabby.....so although your slipping "massively" from an intellectual standpoint with your plethora of spelling error(s), you're apparently getting the job done physically .....which is, of course, the main thing of importance anyway!
Newmastersswimmer
Well, the early 1970's they were swimming less because goggles just became available. It wasn't unit about 1974 that swimmers were doing the 15,000 to 20,000 yard workouts. In 1968 many top swimmers didn't do even 30,000 a week,no goggles. I think that the winner of men's 200 meter fly in 1968 did a 2:06 and in 1976 a 1:59. Today's swimmers swim more yardage than those in 1968 and many in 1972 but probably less those in 1977.
