Controversy continues

Very interesting thread! I agree with many of the insights mentioned here. I used to be running and lifting weights, as a result my body fat was only 7%, with well defined 6 pack abs. I've since switched from running to swimming. I'd think that swimming burns more calorie and is more taxing than running, but the definition on my abs is beginning to fade. I guess our bodies adjust to the sports we do. As swimmers, our bodies can't be too angular and cut, they need to be more round to create less drag. Sort of like F-22 stealth fighter's round shape to avoid rader detection. While F-15 looks mighty good with its chiseled shape, it has too much angular surface areas that reflect radar beams. Micheal Phelps still has a 6 pack abs probably because he's still so young. Ian Thorpe has never been known to have a chiseled physique. He carries a little extra weight imo. But boy can he glide in the water. He uses the fewest number of strokes to cover the races. He makes swimming look easy. Now the million dollar question is, how can we avid swimmers to continue enjoying swimming while maintaining a well defined body? :mad: Can we have both? And the million dollar answer is: Yes, we can have both. Add weight training/ab crunches to your swim training and it should fix this. Swimming by itself probably will not. Plus, adding those two other things or more things will help the swimming.

:thhbbb:And the million dollar answer is: Yes, we can have both. Add weight training/ab crunches to your swim training and it should fix this. Swimming by itself probably will not. Plus, adding those two other things or more things will help the swimming. one of my missions this year is to use the monofin to work my core and see if it hits the abs like crunches can. I may find a way to use it more like an, OMG, Aquaciser, and see what it does.

I have to agree with you. I'm tall, lanky and a sprinter. I remember doing the swim leg of a triathlon relay and coming out of the water behind a woman that was at least 20 lbs heavier than me....and I had swam as hard as I could! The better question, though, is not whether you should have predicted your relative speeds based on your relative sizes, but whether she'd have been even faster if she were leaner. As long as she wasn't so lean as to be unhealthy, I suspect that the answer to that question would be "yes," just because any body mass that isn't creating propulsion creates drag instead. ("Should she lose weight?" or "would losing weight be worth the sacrifice?" is a far more complex question, and one that only she can answer.) My primary sport since childhood has been swimming, although I have never been an "elite" swimmer. I used to run a lot, too, and loved it even though I sucked, but I had to give it up after I injured a knee. I was leaner when I was running (and I swam faster, too), because I was working out more overall. I wasn't actually any lighter, though. I just had less body fat, and bigger legs.

Maglischo's book Swimming Fastest charts the acceleration/deceleration that occurs throughout each of the swim strokes. Breaststroke and fly both have significant speedup/slowdown phases. That explains why these strokes are more tiring to swim fast. You have to use enormous amounts of energy to accelerate your body after each slowdown cycle. Even a world class breaststroke is jerky compared to a typical crawl. The point is that extra body weight will make acceleration more difficult and tiring. This should be most significant to ***/fly swimmers but the basic goal is to have more power and less mass. The flotation provided by less dense bodies is the offset I suppose. My own guess is that this factor is negligible in short races but more significant in distance and open water swimming. I also think a "small" body will have less surface area to cause drag in the water. Better to be a jet ski than a cabin cruiser. These are all theoritical issues and can be completely overcome with better fitness and technique. We all know very good swimmers who do not have the slim/strong/lean build. But they are strong, have great technique, and great fitness.

As a person who has swum at a heavier weight and now swim at a lighter weight I can tell you, I am much faster at the lighter weight. The extra weight on me was a hindrance.

When I first started out and I was on the heavier side and alot slower our coach dragged out one of those grudge belts. She pitted me against the fastest swimmer there, this little college student who could easily lap me in workout. I won the grudge match simply because it was easier for me to drag that extra 110 lbs behind me, than it was for her to drag an extra 200 lbs behind her. So just imagine how as the weight comes off the speed increases because the strength is already there from having to drag the extra weight in the past.

Fort: I'm denser than most (no qualifier needed) and my coach was always trying to help me keep my legs from sinking. May be why Tri people take the easy route with wet suits. I know when I take time off, I put weight on in the middle (love handles) and my legs would still sink. I wonder if I was more of a swimmer in colder water that my body might spread out the wealth of the extra fat as opposed to concentrating it? Granted we are predestined in a lot of things by our genes, but the human body adapts pretty well to the environment and spread the fat out would aid in keeping me warmer with the added benefit of lessening my sinking legs.

Slow getting the legs to stop sinking. I was told a long time ago to get the body into the water. Extend the arms just before entry and the legs will stay up. Make sure we roll and finish the stroke as low on the thigh as possible. So when I have someone whose legs sink I get them to front load and finish low on the thigh.

George: Thanx. I am still trying to figure out my hand entry. I'm going back to FLA next month and have some very specific issues to work on with my coach. As for the finish, my coach has me swim using the board as a buoy and I have to tap it before recovery just to lengthen my stroke. That drill has helped, but I believe it is my hand entry, probably some body roll and possible head position that are causing or exacerbating my sinkage!

I still have plenty of wiggle! Extra weight or not, I don't float well, never have. Extra weight or not, I seem to be more of a sprinter than distance although I hate the 50 free because I always mess up my turn!:thhbbb: