Hi again and thanks for the welcoming comments in my other thread.
Of course after lurking a few weeks, I've got to jump in with a splash, posting a bunch of times in a single day! ;)
But thought this should be a separate thread: I'm planning on two meets in the next few weeks.
1. Senior Games 50 yd freestyle. This one's iffy b/c so far I haven't received the entry form, yet it's generally held around mid-June.
2. A master's meet at the Upper Main Line Y on 6/19. (I'm from the Philly area.) I plan to do the 50 free in that one too.
Here are my questions:
1. Two things I know I need to work on: the dive and the flip turn.
Dive: The coach told me he'd help me w/ the dive next session. I know basically how to dive, just wondering if there are any additional tricks to diving off the starting block.
Flip turn: The flip turn's coming along--as in, I can now SOMETIMES manage to get a decent semblance of a flip turn. (Sometimes what I get is ... a flip gone all wrong. I tend to want to do the flip too far from the wall.) In the second of the two meets, the pool is 50 yards, but in the first, I'm pretty sure it's 25 yards. I'm wondering if it's better simply to do an open turn when racing unless I feel very confident in the flip turn.
2. Obviously in a 50 yard freestyle, I'll never be more than 50 yards behind anyone, BUT so far the best time in workouts (without diving, 26 yard pool, open turns) has been 55. That's definitely not going to put me right up there in the running for hardware, but is it going to leave me so far in the back as to have officials looking impatiently at their hour glasses and reading all of War and Peace while they're waiting for me to finish? ;) Is it possible that simply the dive into the pool and the race day adrenaline will shorten this time? (Also, I suppose doing 5x50 is a bit of a different experience than simply concentrating all one's efforts into a single one.)
I'm not afraid to finish last. Someone has to and I have experience (going to masters' track meets and getting clobbered, but competing mainly w/ myself anyway). But it would be nice to at least be in the mix for second-to-last place. ;)
Bottom line...I'm still willing to try it b/c I figure nothing that happens in the pool either time is likely to be fatal. I'm healthy and there are a lot of ppl who wait and don't try things, afraid of looking foolish, then have regrets if they lose their health. Still, any tips that will help me do the best I can (not worried about others) will help!
Thanks for the informative replies. Lots to think about!
I talked with the meet director on the phone today, and she told me that, in fact, one doesn't even need to start off the block, that it's okay to start in the water. Not sure how that works, though, in terms of the rules you folks are citing. It's tempting since the director told me that the pool is only 3.5' deep the whole way, and I'm not sure I'd be comfortable diving off a starting block into water that shallow. Not that it's impossible...but my strength has never been my coordination. ;)
It's tempting since the director told me that the pool is only 3.5' deep the whole way, and I'm not sure I'd be comfortable diving off a starting block into water that shallow.
You are not allowed to dive off the blocks in water that shallow:
107.2.3 A (2) In pools with water depth 3 feet 6 inches (1.07 meters) to less than 4 feet (1.22 meters) at the starting end, the swimmer must start from the deck or from within the water (manditory)
I am surprised that they still have blocks at the shallow end, USA Swimming would not allow diving in water that shallow.
michael
Originally posted by michaelmoore
Since she was not still after the kids take their mark, she got DQ'd.
That is not what the rule reads She does not have to be motionless only stationary..
And on the whole, I have found that you cannot argue with the meet officials, it gets you no where. And since they are volunteers, I don't want to make their lives hard anyway.
Having been a certified official for 14 years, I am glad that you do not want to make the officials life difficult. It is nice to know that we are appreciated. However, we are in it for the swimmers - USA Swimming has a program called for the kids.
When you question an official, dont go there to argue, go there to find out what the problem is. You should be able to get an answer to
What did the official see?
What was the rule that was broken?
Was the official in position to see it?
If you (or your coach) asks the ref, s/he will go ask the official (starter or deck ref) those questions. If the official says the swimmer was moving the back foot, ask if the swimmer was stationary. Ask to see the rule that was broken. All officials should be able to give an answer to those questions.
I should point out with some embarrassement that I was at the officials meeting at the Summer USA Championships at Stanford when the motionless question came up. There were many officials who would have missed the correct answer (including me). It was a learning experience.
As I said we are in it for the swimmer, and it is important that we get it right.
michael
I find this very informative because I think most officials think if the swimmer moves at all after the mark, they are disqualified. I have seen this happen time and time again, even at the state meets.
I think it is really the coaches job to talk to the official and question a call. Parents are not allowed on deck. I work in the administrative judge position at our meets. I have done the officials training, but have since let my certification lapse. I work with the deck officials alot and know they are a good bunch, and are there for the swimmer. I know some calls are difficult to interpret, and this seems to be one of the,.
Originally posted by michaelmoore
It's tempting since the director told me that the pool is only 3.5' deep the whole way, and I'm not sure I'd be comfortable diving off a starting block into water that shallow.
You are not allowed to dive off the blocks in water that shallow:
107.2.3 A (2) In pools with water depth 3 feet 6 inches (1.07 meters) to less than 4 feet (1.22 meters) at the starting end, the swimmer must start from the deck or from within the water (manditory)
I am surprised that they still have blocks at the shallow end, USA Swimming would not allow diving in water that shallow.
michael
That's a relief! As for whether they have blocks, I'm not sure--the director said that I could start fr/ the water, but come to think of it, I'm not sure I remember whether she said there were blocks even if I did want to use one. I've never actually been to the pool where the meet is being held, so I don't know if there are blocks.
So glad you told me this, though! Thanks for the info! As a total newbie to the world of meets, I'm learning a lot here!
Originally posted by michaelmoore
But my daughter has a problem with that back foot wiggling and getting DQ's because of it.
I would go the the referee to ask if she was stationary at the starting blocks. If he says yes - then she is legal.
The old rule said "When all swimmers are motionless in starting position, gives starting signal." .
That is the rule that many of us learned. The current rule is phrased just a little differently "When all swimmers are stationary, the starter shall give the starting signal."
There is quite a difference between the two, so that if a swimmer is just wiggling the back foot, the start should be legal.
michael
FYI:
The rule for USA Swimming, USMS, and FINA does say "stationary". But the NCAA rule says "motionless". I've found that many kids' swim meets are refereed under NCAA rather than USA Swimming rules.
Originally posted by Bob McAdams
FYI:
The rule for USA Swimming, USMS, and FINA does say "stationary". But the NCAA rule says "motionless". I've found that many kids' swim meets are refereed under NCAA rather than USA Swimming rules.
Since our team is combo Y and USA, I can see the confusion, Y is by NCAA rules. The DQ happened at a USA meet.
