TI Question...heard this and doesn't sound right...
Former Member
I am teaching a stroke clinic class at the YMCA. My background is USS competitive swimming (ages 8-18) and some age-group coaching. One of my students, a triathlon trainer, has been to Total Immersion. Because of his TI training, he is doubtful of any stroke correction I am giving him. Basically he has the typical problems of a short stroke...entering too close to the head and not pulling thru.
The TI triathlete is telling me that the TI "Fish" style swimming technique says the hand should enter the water just in front of the head, then reach forward. In my opinion, he needs to lengthen his stroke, rotating and reaching as far forward as possible, entering out front (not by the head). I am thinking he is mixing up some TI drill with proper freestyle SWIMMING technique. He at least agreed with me when we talked distance per stroke (and started believing I know something about swimming)...but I don't see how you can maximize DPS with hand entry by the head.
Can someone shed light on this for me? What is this "Fish" swimming in a couple sentences? And where does TI say the hand entry should be?
Thank you!!
P.S. I'm new here and enjoying reading...I swim masters and hope to compete in butterfly someday...I'm waiting it out until I get a bit older so can face the competition. My butterfly has held out better than my other strokes (used to be a long distance freestyler too).
P.P.S. I did a search on TI and read some of the posts but they didn't quite get to my specific question above.
Parents
Former Member
Originally posted by ShariL
...
One thing I know for sure is that the great swimmers of the world are not putting their hand in right by their head...
...
Thanks again!
No way:
the great swimmers of the world are not putting their hand right by their head, stretch the hand underwater against resistent water, then when the arm is stretched start the catch and the pull.
Goofy public swimmers do this, though.
The great swimmers of the world want the arm stretched as quickly as possible, so they stretch the arm in the less resistent air, they hit the water with an almost stretched arm (I have seen some who do stretch the arm a little bit, not much, underwater) or with a fully stretched arm, then they start the catch and the pull.
A description of the kayak style -missing from the T.I. book and mentioned by Gareth in his post-, is in 'Swimming Technique' from April/July 2003, where Cecil Colwin states in page 16:
"At speed, however, when meeting a challenge, as in Thorpe's classic race with Grant Hackett in the 800 meter freestyle in Fukoaka 2001 (i.e.: Ian Thorpe (Aus.) at 7:39.16 and Grant Hackett (Aus.) at 7:40.34 swam then the two fastest 800 meter free in history), both swimmers switched to a rotary stroke..."
and
"...has been called a rotary stroke because the arms rotate continously at almost the same speed (i.e. the arms don't overlap, they are always at least 90 degrees apart, and often they are at 180 degrees opposition, as it is when one arm enters the water and the other arm exits). The rotary action is the main feature of the stroke, and it was brought to a high point of development by Alexander Popov,...";
Popov, the T.I. model, swims rotary, kayak style.
Very dramatic rotary, kayak style, swimmers who "...are not putting their hand in right by their head..." because they swim with straight -not bent- and fully stretched arms above the water, are Michael Klim (Aus.) -who is second fastest man in history in 100 meter free at 48.18- and Inge de Bruijn (Ned.) -who is the fastest woman in history in 100 meter free at 53.77-.
Long distance swimmer Grant Hackett (Aus.) -who has the world record in the 1500 meter free at 14:34.56-, bends his arms above the water, but he is not putting his hand right by his head, no way, because he is still stretching his arms above the water quite far from his head.
Underwater, he is stretching a little bit the arm to full extension, than he starts the catch and the pull.
To me, people who are "...putting their hand in right by their head..." are usually overzealous public swimmers, in an imaginary rush, just to swim the wrong ways.
Originally posted by ShariL
...
One thing I know for sure is that the great swimmers of the world are not putting their hand in right by their head...
...
Thanks again!
No way:
the great swimmers of the world are not putting their hand right by their head, stretch the hand underwater against resistent water, then when the arm is stretched start the catch and the pull.
Goofy public swimmers do this, though.
The great swimmers of the world want the arm stretched as quickly as possible, so they stretch the arm in the less resistent air, they hit the water with an almost stretched arm (I have seen some who do stretch the arm a little bit, not much, underwater) or with a fully stretched arm, then they start the catch and the pull.
A description of the kayak style -missing from the T.I. book and mentioned by Gareth in his post-, is in 'Swimming Technique' from April/July 2003, where Cecil Colwin states in page 16:
"At speed, however, when meeting a challenge, as in Thorpe's classic race with Grant Hackett in the 800 meter freestyle in Fukoaka 2001 (i.e.: Ian Thorpe (Aus.) at 7:39.16 and Grant Hackett (Aus.) at 7:40.34 swam then the two fastest 800 meter free in history), both swimmers switched to a rotary stroke..."
and
"...has been called a rotary stroke because the arms rotate continously at almost the same speed (i.e. the arms don't overlap, they are always at least 90 degrees apart, and often they are at 180 degrees opposition, as it is when one arm enters the water and the other arm exits). The rotary action is the main feature of the stroke, and it was brought to a high point of development by Alexander Popov,...";
Popov, the T.I. model, swims rotary, kayak style.
Very dramatic rotary, kayak style, swimmers who "...are not putting their hand in right by their head..." because they swim with straight -not bent- and fully stretched arms above the water, are Michael Klim (Aus.) -who is second fastest man in history in 100 meter free at 48.18- and Inge de Bruijn (Ned.) -who is the fastest woman in history in 100 meter free at 53.77-.
Long distance swimmer Grant Hackett (Aus.) -who has the world record in the 1500 meter free at 14:34.56-, bends his arms above the water, but he is not putting his hand right by his head, no way, because he is still stretching his arms above the water quite far from his head.
Underwater, he is stretching a little bit the arm to full extension, than he starts the catch and the pull.
To me, people who are "...putting their hand in right by their head..." are usually overzealous public swimmers, in an imaginary rush, just to swim the wrong ways.
