TI Question...heard this and doesn't sound right...
Former Member
I am teaching a stroke clinic class at the YMCA. My background is USS competitive swimming (ages 8-18) and some age-group coaching. One of my students, a triathlon trainer, has been to Total Immersion. Because of his TI training, he is doubtful of any stroke correction I am giving him. Basically he has the typical problems of a short stroke...entering too close to the head and not pulling thru.
The TI triathlete is telling me that the TI "Fish" style swimming technique says the hand should enter the water just in front of the head, then reach forward. In my opinion, he needs to lengthen his stroke, rotating and reaching as far forward as possible, entering out front (not by the head). I am thinking he is mixing up some TI drill with proper freestyle SWIMMING technique. He at least agreed with me when we talked distance per stroke (and started believing I know something about swimming)...but I don't see how you can maximize DPS with hand entry by the head.
Can someone shed light on this for me? What is this "Fish" swimming in a couple sentences? And where does TI say the hand entry should be?
Thank you!!
P.S. I'm new here and enjoying reading...I swim masters and hope to compete in butterfly someday...I'm waiting it out until I get a bit older so can face the competition. My butterfly has held out better than my other strokes (used to be a long distance freestyler too).
P.P.S. I did a search on TI and read some of the posts but they didn't quite get to my specific question above.
Parents
Former Member
Shari.....you are correct, of course, as is Ion. The reason no-one is responding seems to me to be a nervousness about being jumped if one says anything critical of TI.
Never fear, I am here and willing to speak what little mind I have left.
The problem, in my opinion, with learning swimming from a manual or a tape is that there is no feedback. Period.
This allows all sorts of gremlins to slither into the learning process.
I've had people interpreting what they thought they heard or read in TI and many other self-help learning aids.
For example, a swimmer tells me they are going to "swim downhill". Try it sometime. Ridiculous. However, to the stereotypical heads-up Triathlete type, it FEELS like they are swimming downhill. Big difference.
Second example: "look straight down at the bottom". When I do that (and my fellow Masters) forward motion is substantially and noticeably reduced.
You must remember that TI (it appears) was created for the great unwashed multitudes and has some definite holes in it for serious competitors.
As an aside, I noticed on the TI tape that the person doing the excellent job of demonstrating was not doing what the tape said to do !!
It has taken me three weeks to stamp out some of the foolishness that my new team had created for themselves by mis-interpreting the TI drills. We're swimming much faster and smarter now, thank you very much !
Bottom line : I enjoyed the TI tape and found very little to disagree with. The problem lies with the beholder, not the teaching tool.
Finally, DPS by self-definition requires a far-forward entry and maximum push past the hips.
Over to you...............
Bert
Shari.....you are correct, of course, as is Ion. The reason no-one is responding seems to me to be a nervousness about being jumped if one says anything critical of TI.
Never fear, I am here and willing to speak what little mind I have left.
The problem, in my opinion, with learning swimming from a manual or a tape is that there is no feedback. Period.
This allows all sorts of gremlins to slither into the learning process.
I've had people interpreting what they thought they heard or read in TI and many other self-help learning aids.
For example, a swimmer tells me they are going to "swim downhill". Try it sometime. Ridiculous. However, to the stereotypical heads-up Triathlete type, it FEELS like they are swimming downhill. Big difference.
Second example: "look straight down at the bottom". When I do that (and my fellow Masters) forward motion is substantially and noticeably reduced.
You must remember that TI (it appears) was created for the great unwashed multitudes and has some definite holes in it for serious competitors.
As an aside, I noticed on the TI tape that the person doing the excellent job of demonstrating was not doing what the tape said to do !!
It has taken me three weeks to stamp out some of the foolishness that my new team had created for themselves by mis-interpreting the TI drills. We're swimming much faster and smarter now, thank you very much !
Bottom line : I enjoyed the TI tape and found very little to disagree with. The problem lies with the beholder, not the teaching tool.
Finally, DPS by self-definition requires a far-forward entry and maximum push past the hips.
Over to you...............
Bert
