And the ESPY goes to....

Originally posted by KenChertoff That's an interesting point. There have occasionally been periods when tennis has gotten a lot of attention -- particularly when Jimmy Connors and John McEnroe were at their peaks and behaving badly. The same for Andre Agassi before he grew up. But when Pete Sampras was the top player, the media seemed bored. (Likewise, figure skating never got as much attention as during the Tonya Harding scandal.) Which I guess shows that the media is mostly interested in spectacle. Of course, it may also mean that for swimming to get attention, the swimmers would have to have tantrums and generally act like jerks -- I think I'd rather do without the attention, in that case :). Hmmm... I think you said it better than I did. Popularity seems to wax and wane. Like with figure skating, even though I believe they have less competetive events during the course of a year, they have all sorts of specials, Skate this and Skate that, but unless there is a scandal, you kind of have to catch the specials by accident. So at least they get a little media coverage Meanwhile, swim this's and swim that's aren't covered at all.... so we're back to jumping through hoops or immoral havoc on behalf of our swimmers whom I think behave rather admirably compared to other "sports" people out there. You're right... I'd rather forget the media attention.

In order to not be "...befuddled" aqua, read better my posts, then address their content. A small correction in what I wrote: the 2000 US Olympic Trials in swimming, was covered by NBC; ESPN covered with similar defects the 2000 NCAA swimming. 2000 Olympic Trials in swimming and 2000 NCAA in swimming were covered in US respectively by NBC, and ESPN, and that was to the 'understanding' of popular US culture by NBC and ESPN bosses; there were not 250 stations to chose from.

aqua, the TV bosses don't know much about sports, but decide the sports shows anyway based on the local sterotypes of a place, and overwhelm the population with their cliches, then care about resulting ratings and commercial revenue; the population follows gullibly; I lived in Romania for 18 years, France for 11, Canada for 6 and US for 6, and saw it being done in each country to the level of the local popular culture of a few decision makers for TV. A good example is the 2000 US Olympic Trials in swimming, a poorly made ESPN program, which for example was showing from the 14.59.xx in 1500 free by Erik Vendt just a few finishing strokes. All athletes who prepared it, stepped on the blocks and raced it from start to finish, were't shown, and this is the fault of the TV commentator, who knows better than the ESPN bossses since is a famous swimmer, but didn't stand up to educate the ESPN bosses and defend swimming for a better prepared coverage.

Leaving the sports vs. game debate aside, intersting and funny in some cases as it is (and thanks to Rob Copeland for the ESPY to Ion for the most posts - I needed the laugh tonight)... Did tennis get as much hype and TV coverage *before* the Williams' phenoms as it does now? I play it myself, but never paid much attention to the pro aspect of it until the last few years. I seem to recall growing up, that tennis was about like swimming in that it was a country club sport not destined for TV greatness. Now tennis has broken that mold, personally I think mainly because of a few greats that have sprung up. Our famed swimmers (at least famed to us) are phenomenal in our minds, and I find myself asking... how much more do they have to do? Swim through hoops, literally? So is it all the sport in general or how much do you think has to do with individual players in general and their media attractiveness.

Originally posted by cinc310 Swimmers also have bad behavior as well but not as extreme as Tonya Harding. Someone told me that has a general interest in sports that years ago a woman in the olympic village asked Matt Blondi if he was a basketabll player, and he and his friends made fun of the woman for not knowing he was a famous swimmer. Also, swimming on one team where we had a lot of really good swimmers as a kid, many of the better swimmers kind of made fun of me. So swimmers are not immune to rude behavior. Oh this is totally true... no one is immue from unacceptable behavior, pro, amateur, or sports unlinclined. But *comparatively* I think, like Ken pointed out, we see it a lot more in the more "covered" sports. John McEnroe? :) I would go even farther and say I was thinking in terms of Micheal Ervin's inability to keep his hands to himself, and oh geez... what's the boxer's name??? Well, you know. And Darryl Strawberry's libation of certain substances. And lest we forget OJ's temper (sometimes possibly manifesting itself in permanent ways.. I'm trying to be diplomatic here). Swimmers certainly aren't immune. Didn't Gary Hall Jr. have some issues? But I think I'd love to do a dissertation on media coverage and "problems" in sports. I think, personally, swimming would be at the top with the least. Pro players might respond that the media coverage makes things so difficult. Yeah. Hard life, isn't it?

Originally posted by Bert Petersen Ever notice that we "play" football, water polo, etc.? But we do not play track and field, gymnastics ,etc. That is how you tell a game from a sport..........................:p I can't believe you do not consider water polo a sport. For shame.

I would have to second the for shame of Bert Peterson, Water Polo not a sport - WOW! then why did they use Terry Schroeder as a model for the Statue at the Colesium in Los Angeles. For Ion, I noticed you didn't mention Ice Hockey, Soccer or Boxing as sports, I'm sure this is an oversight, then again George Foreman in the later years would not be the ideal athletic body (but still a very fit athlete in my book). You put down wrestling as a sport (I'll assume not WWF - but then again....), what about sumo wrestling (once again not the 'fit' athlete but still an athlete). How about fencing (no not barb wire - but sword play - speed, finesse doesn't take a lot of strength to play/participate). To say golf is not a sport, I would challenge anyone to go out and hit a golf ball 300+ yards, that takes skill and strength, I know I can swim faster than Tiger Woods and bench Press more than him, but I know he can definitely hit a golf ball farther me, same goes for Mo Vaughn who can hit and probably throw a baseball farther than I ever will. Lastly to blast the TV for not covering the the entire Olympics 1500 is wrong. How often do you at a swim meet watch every heat of a 1500 (unless of course you are swimming it). I have seen swimmers leave during the 1500 so what makes you think Joe Public would be entranced of this physical endeavor. Bottom line would you like to be congratulated by someone who knows nothing about you and say good job even though you had a horrible swim or would you rather have that from your peers when you do it right and have earned it. Jeff

Swimming is NOT the be all and end all of competitive sport. It would however be nice if its deserving athletes were recognized on occasion to perhaps popularize the sport a little better than it is now. To not give female college athlete of the year to Ms. Coughlin is like not giving golfer of the year to Tiger Woods. Well maybe not THAT bad but close. I really think it went to Sue Bird because the only women's college team ESPN knew the WHOLE nation would be familiar with was UConn BB. I'm not even going to enter the sport vs. not a sport discussion other than to say every game/sport/exhibition/display we see on TV advertised as part of the "sporting world" contains individuals who are EXTREMELY talented at their respective game/sport/exhiition/display. -RM

To Tall Paul, Tom Ellison and Jeff Kaelon stating that on TV swimming appears boring: in www.usswim.org, Australians are posting a lot about TV channels competing for swimming coverage, and the quality of these programs, including Grant Hackett (Aus) 1500 meter free races, with the slowest of his opponents in finals being shown from introduction in the marshalling area until the end of the race he fights for. Now we are talking about 'supply and demand'. To Jeff about me omitting some sports: yes, about ice hockey, fencing, speed skating and boxing; boxing is in fact a complete sport, but I omitted it because is extremely violent; ten days ago, a boxer died one day after a match, because of the blows he received.

Originally posted by cinc310 Swimmers also have bad behavior as well but not as extreme as Tonya Harding. Someone told me that has a general interest in sports that years ago a woman in the olympic village asked Matt Blondi if he was a basketabll player, and he and his friends made fun of the woman for not knowing he was a famous swimmer. Also, swimming on one team where we had a lot of really good swimmers as a kid, many of the better swimmers kind of made fun of me. So swimmers are not immune to rude behavior. True and unfortunate, but generally in private and nowhere near as prevalent. In fact, I've personally encountered some very obnoxious behavior from a well-known Olympian who was visiting my home pool (I won't mention his name). Nevertheless, you almost never see the kind of public tantrums that John McEnroe was famous for when calls went against him (remember: "You can NOT be serious!). which is what gets media attention.