Now that I've gone through the hassle of signing up as a member of this dicussion group, this gets more and more fun. Maybe I'll get fired from my job :)
Anyway... I'm sure that ALL Masters level swimmers have heard of Total Immersion (from now on referred to as TI) swimming, correct? What are everyone's opinions about TI swimming? I am most curious because as a coach of age group swimmers, I was looking for training videos for our kids. I happened upon TI and liked what I saw... at first.
Here's some background for my experience with TI... very well put together, most of what they teach has been in existence for some time anyway, and they certainly are good for teaching novice/beginner swimmers the basic technique for swimming.
However, when looking to swim fast, and I mean fast, not lap swim quality, but truly competitively, I thing TI has missed to boat completely. Yes, smooth and efficient swimming is nice, but did anyone see the NCAA's? There are 20 year old men swimming 9 strokes per length in breaststroke! We have a number of age group coaches in my area teaching their kids how to swim breaststroke at 6 or 7 strokes a length!!! What gives? Extended glide is one thing, but when you slow down your stroke to such an extent just to achieve long and fluid strokes you sacrifice speed tremendously.
Hey, if you can swim 9 strokes a length at 1 second per stroke that is WAY better than 6 strokes a length at 2 seconds per stroke. Simple math.
Anthony Ervin of Cal swam the 100 free in the follwing SPL... 12 (start)/15/16/16. I could be off but that's what I was able to get from the (ahem- PALTRY) ESPN coverage. Now TI has goal SPL's of 12/13! Hello, if the BEST sprinter in history takes 8 cycles, shouldn't that tell us something? Turnover is very important. Same with streamlining, yes streamlines are nice and quite important but A.E. pops up after 5 yards MAX out of each turn. You only serve yourself well if your streamline is faster than you can swim, most age group swimmers would be well-served to explode out of the turn and swim within 3-4 yards.
Alas, it's been a slow day finishing my work for the week. Just looking to start a nice discussion. It's been my experience that a lot of Masters level swimmers are also engaged in coaching age group swimming at some level, and therefore I feel we can get some good dialogue going on this issue.
Now I've just used TI as an example because that's what I've had my experience with, but more general is what keys do you all stress when trying to mold competitive swimmers?
Au revoir,
-Rain Man
Parents
Former Member
Originally posted by emmett
...
It sounds like YOU are looking for a shortcut to better technique. You have also, in my estimation, been using hard training as a shortcut, of sorts, perhaps hoping that simply swimming longerharderandfaster will make you a better swimmer. Except in the extremely rare instance of the True Natural Elite Athlete, it won't. For the overwhelming majority of us only working on your technique will improve technique. All the conditioning in the world won't make up for poor technique if you are really striving to reach your potential as a swimmer.
Emmett,
in order for me to believe in a swimming program, there has to be obvious evidence of a coach's personal success.
I mean by a coach's evidence of personal success, coaching like Mike Bottom (US) allegedly does, like Nagyi (Hun) allegedly did coach Borrowman (US), or the coach having been a good competitor.
Speaking of such a coach's personal success, the best I was exposed to in detail, was when I started swimming in 1984 and saw almost every day until 1986, Guy Boissiere (Fra.) coaching Stephane Caron (Fra.).
The coach took Stephane Caron and other stars, from kids learning how to swim, to senior competitors.
Caron won a bronze medal in 100 meter free in 1988SeoulOlympics, and a bronze medal in 1992BarcelonaOlympics. In Barcelona he defeated Matt Biondi (US).
Boissiere's work outs didn't have Total Immersion claims. I have written some of them in a diary I keep, since 1984.
When Boissiere was saying something at that time, I was believing it then and I believe it now.
I wrote my previous post about Total Immersion, the way I judged its claims when I was in Tennessee in 1999 and 2000, and the LMSC newsletter was describing it in many long articles.
Originally posted by emmett
...
It sounds like YOU are looking for a shortcut to better technique. You have also, in my estimation, been using hard training as a shortcut, of sorts, perhaps hoping that simply swimming longerharderandfaster will make you a better swimmer. Except in the extremely rare instance of the True Natural Elite Athlete, it won't. For the overwhelming majority of us only working on your technique will improve technique. All the conditioning in the world won't make up for poor technique if you are really striving to reach your potential as a swimmer.
Emmett,
in order for me to believe in a swimming program, there has to be obvious evidence of a coach's personal success.
I mean by a coach's evidence of personal success, coaching like Mike Bottom (US) allegedly does, like Nagyi (Hun) allegedly did coach Borrowman (US), or the coach having been a good competitor.
Speaking of such a coach's personal success, the best I was exposed to in detail, was when I started swimming in 1984 and saw almost every day until 1986, Guy Boissiere (Fra.) coaching Stephane Caron (Fra.).
The coach took Stephane Caron and other stars, from kids learning how to swim, to senior competitors.
Caron won a bronze medal in 100 meter free in 1988SeoulOlympics, and a bronze medal in 1992BarcelonaOlympics. In Barcelona he defeated Matt Biondi (US).
Boissiere's work outs didn't have Total Immersion claims. I have written some of them in a diary I keep, since 1984.
When Boissiere was saying something at that time, I was believing it then and I believe it now.
I wrote my previous post about Total Immersion, the way I judged its claims when I was in Tennessee in 1999 and 2000, and the LMSC newsletter was describing it in many long articles.
