Reasonable seed times

At Santa Clara last year was the firs time I've ever gone for a "time/record" in an event from my "split". I entered the 1000 and went for a 100 free time, I had to notify the meet director who told the starter, who announced what I was doing to the heat. In spite of all that I felt pretty uncomfotable about going out in 47 seconds for the first 100 of a 1000 free and made sure I personally told all the swimmers around me what I was doing, hopefully it made their races a little more enjoyable. I'd hate to see us "legislate" this sort of thing, ideally we all approach meets with a sense of respect for those around us. However I do beleive that ultimately swimming is a very individual sport and that we as atheletes need to learn to adapt/react to each race regardless of what someone else is doing in the lane next to ours.

What Bob said. "The new center of masters swimming" :) is seeing very long meet sessions at championships as well. Every minute counts. With each meet we run, we learn a little more. Note also for USA Swimming rules on intermediate distances... as far as I know, there is no requirement of notifying others in the heat that you're going for a split time, but it's definitely a polite thing to do. Also, for the time to count, you need to finish your own race legally. In a relay, if you lead off, you only need to finish your own leg legally. If the relay gets DQed for a false start, etc., your lead-off split still counts. -Rick

Michael Moore has provided a good summary of the reasons why many of us want people to provide resonable seed times. In fact, the vast majority (more than 95%) of people do their very best in putting in seed times. Nevertheless, as Michael points out, that very small minority can have an impact on the 95% in terms of a timeline (just think about the impact of having an extra heat of the 1650 on the day's timeline when some fast swimmers but in bogus seed time and force a 25 minute 1650 into the second heat). Since our pre-meet literature did not clearly state guidelines or rules regarding seed times we have decided that we cannot change seed times or DQ people for unsportsmanlike conduct for bogus seed times. NEXT YEAR, however, we will change this. We believe that a meet director should be able to change an unreasonable seed time (think of the hypothetical but not so rare 1650 example above) to keep the meet competitive and to enhance the meet experience for all (think earlier finishes).

I do beleive the USMS rule book indicates that for an intermediate distance to count for record or TT that the official must be notified in advance that such a swim is being done. The officials I've seen generally then make an announcement of this to the field prior to the start.

I recently participated in a meet where, due to circumstances, we threw out the entire pre-seeded meet plan. When it was time to start an event, everyone entered in the event (young/old/male/female/fast/slow) marshaled with the referee and just picked a lane. We had heats with mixed sexes, fast swimmers along the wall lanes, oldest and youngest next to each other, you name it! I didn’t hear one complaint about it…everyone seemed to think that it was pretty fun. Nobody thought that it was inconsiderate. I'm sympathetic to Rick because I also run Masters meets. My point, though, is that seeding can’t and shouldn’t be legislated beyond what already exists in our rules. I try my best to seed myself accurately even if it would be competitively disadvantageous to do so. I do that because many participants enjoy the meet experience better if my performance meets their expectations. (It also makes the meet run faster and smoother) However, I am not concerned about trying to meet someone else’s expectations. I do not care if I make other swimmers angry/happy because I swim faster/slower than my seed time. (Or, whether I'm going out too fast for you because I'm going for an intermediate time.) It is not something that you, I, or they should worry about. Likewise, I’ve been in meets where we’ve had some swimmers in a heat swimming freestyle and others swimming IM or strokes. I’ve never seen anyone express a hint of anger or dismay about that. That’s not to say that people don’t get upset when false seedings and similar things occur (as many speakers here have expressed). But there are also people out there who don’t care and/or believe that such actions do fall within the definition of “sportsmanship”. It’s a judgment item in the eyes of the beholder. Officially, it’s a judgment item in the eyes of the referee. It should stay that way. One final sea story: I participated in a different meet, not too long ago, where I seeded myself much slower than I normally did. It was, however, an accurate seeding given that I was recovering from an injury. The mere fact of my presence in the early heats among much older swimmers, however, drew evil stares and comments. I was where I should be in order to make the meet run efficiently, but it still seemed to upset some participants. Think about that.

Paul: You are exactly right in what you just said. Your motives were correct and you handled it like the gentleman I'm sure you are. I think the original concern here was about people who enter BOGUS times for less than honorable reasons, (getting more rest than their competition, clear water, etc), This is what I object to. It's a sportsmanship issue. Yes/no ???? Bert