Second round bonk blues

RE: Second round bonk blues

67King — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 11:03:20 GMT

My most typical fly set is 4X(6X25 on :36), extra minute of rest between each of the 4 groups. Before COVID, I would do that, coming in at :13 for the first few, then settle in at :14 for the bulk of the set, then taper down to :15 for maybe a quarter of it, then the last couple were at :16. But even the one I did yesterday was only 25 at a time (the second half of the 50's were 25 easy free/25 fly@pace). If I'm doing work on 200 fly or 400IM, I do the Yajima Yuya thing.......take a really long glide before initiating my pull, trying to be sure some part of my body remains above the water to stay legal. But I was working on the 100 fly yesterday. I had no access to pools from March until September. Did a lot of open water. My stamina improved, but my strokes lost form. I am still trying to "find" my fly form. Every time I do a fly workout, I catch bits of that easy, relaxed gliding. I also find that if I think about slowing down my tempo, I get more core more involved, and glide higher in the water. Too fast, and it is all arms......which is to say violent and taxing. I am sure my second kick is not doing me favors in lifting my body up to make the recovery portion of the stroke more relaxed. The sleep thing is what it is. Girls practice from 5-7 before school, it is about a half hour away. And in the evenings, the youngest pracitces until 8, then after dinner and cleaning up, I'm lucky to be in bed by 11. During the Summer, things are better, and it was one Summer when I realized I was a lot faster when I was rested, and might actually be able to do an NQT. Was interesting to see the same thing happen to me on both strokes, looking back at the data from my watch. However, today I did the same workout as above, but only with backstroke, and it did not repeat itself. So who knows? Thanks to both of you for the feedback. God willing I'll be able to keep in the pool.

RE: Second round bonk blues

Patrick W. Brundage — Wed, 16 Dec 2020 09:39:47 GMT

Of all the strokes**, butterfly is the first stroke to go to s**t in terms of form in a workout ... and, while you should always swim with good form on all strokes, it's the one stroke you really should never practice with crappy form. I will almost always stop swimming fly in a workout once my form falls apart, or reduce the distance so that I can swim with good form. I do love to race butterfly and I particularly love the 200 fly (my second favorite event), but ... because form can fall apart so fast in fly in a workout ... Virtually all of my repeats are 25s or 50s ... even when I'm explicitly training for a 200 fly The only time I swim more than a 50 fly straight in a workout is when I'm doing a 400 IM ... but even though that's my favorite event, I don't do that very often because of the risk to my fly form on the 100 I never care about heart rate on fly ... but always care about stroke count I will stop a set of fly if my stroke count per lap gets above 2 of my target ... because that almost for sure means that my form is suffering If I was training for a 100 fly and trying to get to 1:04, I'd primarily do sets of 25s, trying to target 0:15 to 0:16 race pace per 25. Here's a 'build to a broken 100' variation I use. On the interval side, I'd "build backwards" from the last round where I'm trying to go the 25s at race pace on a 1:1 work:rest ratio. So, that last round would be on 0:30 4 x (25-75) - on 1:30, 25 race pace fly followed by 75 easy free or back. 4 x (25-50) - on 1:15 per 75, going 1st 25 at race pace, get your time and then right into 50 easy 4 x (25-25) - on 0:55 per 50, going 1st 25 at race pace, get your time and then right into 25 easy 4 x 25: on 0:30, hit target race pace on each 25 Take an extra easy 50 after each round on 1:00 to 1:30 You'll note that the intervals get easier as the set progresses, but the active rest swimming decreases. That is, on round #1, you're on a 0:45/50 interval, whereas on round #3, you're on a 0:55/50 interval This is a short set, but pretty intense. The other point I'd note, as you've already recognized, is sleep. I'm a notoriously bad sleeper and for many, many years, my business travel (including stints of lots of cross-country mixed with overseas travel) meant that I was sleeping in that 4-5 hour range. I've known for decades that I swim better when I'm more in the 6-8 hour range, but only this year have gotten into that groove. If there's anything you can do to sleep more, try it. If you want motivation to do so, check out this recent podcast - www.npr.org/.../radio-replay-eyes-wide-open ** This doesn't apply to those enviable freaks of nature who are 'natural butterflyers'

RE: Second round bonk blues

ganache — Tue, 15 Dec 2020 08:21:40 GMT

I do not think it is strength or cardio. When I am coaching fly I try to get the swimmer to try to relax as much as possible during the arm recovery and hand "entry". Since I cannot watch you swim I have a question. Do you feel like you are working the whole time you are swimming fly? Like freestyle, you should feel like you are not working during the arm recovery. When you are bringing your arms over the water, try to relax as much as possible. Also try to let your hands land on the surface rather then go too deep. Like in freestyle, you do not want your hands to enter deep as you then lose part of the pull. When your hands land on the surface you should relax everything from the waist up and let your chest and chin drop down into the water (keeping your hands high near the surface if possible). This will happen naturally. Relax your back (too many swimmers keep their back stiff and this prevents their chest from sinking down). Imagine someone pushing down on your relaxed back for a second. Then the air in your lungs will start to push your chest back up. During this time you should be relaxed, until as your body starts to rise you start to drop your forearms (keeping your elbows high) to begin the pull. Also I would try to rise as little as possible during the breath or non-breath stroke (if you breathe every other stroke). Drag your chin in the water if you can still get air. If you can convince yourself you are relaxing (during the recovery and hand entry) and only working during the pull you will be able to hold the pace you can sustain. I hope this helps. Strength training is important but most swimmers I have worked with did not need to get stronger to swim fly faster or longer. I would assume this is true of your improvements in freestyle. Hope this helps. Let me know if you have questions about what I am suggesting.