Help me learn to love my snorkel

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 10:59:54 GMT

I last attended a workout about four years ago. I did not like what the coach a fourteen year old was having master swimmers doing. He was coaching??? three lanes of master swimmers. The head coach working with the other three lanes (a former Olympian). All drills (I hate drills) for 3 days, that was it for me again. End of a come back. And that probably works fine for a short workout. But our average workout is over 4,000 so if all of that was straight, full-stroke swimming, I'd be full-on Shining-crazy by the halfway point. And because I can't resist a Simpsons quote ... "Shh! You want to get sued? Now look, boy: if your Dad goes gaga, you just use that... Shin of yours to call me and I'll come a runnin'. But don't be readin' my mind between four and five. That's Willy's time!"

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 10:50:42 GMT

And that probably works fine for a short workout. But our average workout is over 4,000 so if all of that was straight, full-stroke swimming, I'd be full-on Shining-crazy by the halfway point. And because I can't resist a Simpsons quote ... "Shh! You want to get sued? Now look, boy: if your Dad goes gaga, you just use that... Shin of yours to call me and I'll come a runnin'. But don't be readin' my mind between four and five. That's Willy's time!"

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

knelson — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 10:43:36 GMT

Variety is the spice of life, George.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 10:41:14 GMT

I am wondering how any one doing 1000 meters a day can possibly get bored (sometimes 2 X1000m a day). It works out the way I do it to be about 20 to 30 minutes. Thinking about technique, every move I make and helping others. My thousand meters is swum by the clock doing 25s, 50s and 100s And keeping it really boring.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 10:24:18 GMT

While I don't have ADHD in my dry life, I definitely have it in the pool. So I love a healthy mix of kicking (with and without boards), pulling, drilling, full-stroke swimming and the occasional game. The more variety I get, the more I stay mentally engaged. Most importantly, I like coaches that use them all creatively -- and take the time to explain why you're doing them. As such, when I teach, I always try to work this info into the set instructions and I don't introduce a new drill if I can't give my students a good reason for doing it.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 09:55:56 GMT

As I said every one can kick all they want. You can use a snorkel if you want. I will not be stretching. I will not be using any devices. I like what I do. Which probably does not mean much to any body. Hey I have not raced since 1998 and may never race again. But I am hankering to get back in the swim. I will not be kicking with a board or without a board and no snorkelling for balance. I will be swimming full stroke and keeping it simple.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 09:16:26 GMT

Do you really think you are swimming well because you are using a kick board.??? I have heard all this kick stuff before from a few others.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 08:56:31 GMT

I am very happy to see others use these gimmicky gadgets. There is a thing called wasted time. Do I really have to come back and race again to show you that there is an easier way. The easier way is full stroke swimming. Rather than just your bald assertions, do you have any reasons these things are bad? When I was in HS and college -- and a much faster kicker than now -- I used a kickboard exclusively. That's just the way almost everyone trained their kick at the time. Nowadays I split about evenly with and without a board. Kicking without a board is better to include hypoxic training (probably a bad idea in your book too, right?) and to better simulate actual race conditions. I use a kickboard if I am doing aerobic/endurance kicking for general leg conditioning, or if I just don't want to have to worry about hypoxic training. I see lots of people who say a kickboard is bad because body position is bad. I think that's bunk. Sure, the body position isn't exactly the same but from the abs down it is probably pretty similar. And in any event, for training the legs, it doesn't matter. The most useless kicking exercise (IMO) is doing dolphin kick on your back while on the surface of the water. That's completely different than doing it underwater, and it also doesn't match anything you do while racing. If you are hung up on body position while using a board, then I would recommend getting a FINIS alignment kickboard and using a FINIS snorkel with it. (And no, I am not a paid FINIS rep.)

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Michael Heather — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 06:49:55 GMT

I will stop short of agreeing with George, but understand his sentiment. I use a kickboard, paddles and a pull buoy in training (no snorkel), but the vast amount is just swimming. The reason? Mostly because I feel awful taking my stroke apart. Drills are useless to me without a coach critiquing them on every length (how many of us get THAT treat?). I kick sometimes with a board, sometimes on my side, sometimes with fins. That part is definitely an asset to racing for me. Everything else, not so much. I love to swim but if there were no meets, I would not be a regular at workout. I heard a quote from Natalie Coughlin early this year that I will now paraphrase," Every time I get in the pool, I try to have a perfect stroke, kick, pushoff. Even in warmups." Junk yardage is not a distance, it is lack of effort to improve.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

The Fortress — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 06:10:10 GMT

I will be swimming full stroke and keeping it simple. And keeping it really boring.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Chris Stevenson — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 05:49:33 GMT

I am very happy to see others use these gimmicky gadgets. There is a thing called wasted time. Do I really have to come back and race again to show you that there is an easier way. The easier way is full stroke swimming. So your basic reasoning seems to be: if Tarzan didn't train that way, it is a waste of time. That's what I thought.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Elaine Krugman — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 05:41:56 GMT

I do just fine on a heavy diet of kicking. :applaud:

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Allen Stark — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 05:37:23 GMT

Do you really think you are swimming well because you are using a kick board.??? I have heard all this kick stuff before from a few others. I don't use a kickboard because I do most of my kicking with the snorkel(which is what this thread is about),but re:kicking-every month in Swimming World they have an interview with a coach and every month they ask how important is kicking in their program.Every month the answer is very important.Some of these coaches are high volume,some are high intensity,but all are pro-kicking.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

The Fortress — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 05:08:56 GMT

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Speedo — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 05:06:29 GMT

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

rtodd — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 04:44:22 GMT

If you are hung up on body position while using a board, then I would recommend getting a FINIS alignment kickboard and using a FINIS snorkel with it. (And no, I am not a paid FINIS rep.) That's a great way to do it for those with bad lower backs and don't want to put an uncomfortable arch in the back.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Chris Stevenson — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 02:52:48 GMT

The worst thing they could use - a kickboard. Next a Pull Bouy. Rather than just your bald assertions, do you have any reasons these things are bad? When I was in HS and college -- and a much faster kicker than now -- I used a kickboard exclusively. That's just the way almost everyone trained their kick at the time. Nowadays I split about evenly with and without a board. Kicking without a board is better to include hypoxic training (probably a bad idea in your book too, right?) and to better simulate actual race conditions. I use a kickboard if I am doing aerobic/endurance kicking for general leg conditioning, or if I just don't want to have to worry about hypoxic training. I see lots of people who say a kickboard is bad because body position is bad. I think that's bunk. Sure, the body position isn't exactly the same but from the abs down it is probably pretty similar. And in any event, for training the legs, it doesn't matter. The most useless kicking exercise (IMO) is doing dolphin kick on your back while on the surface of the water. That's completely different than doing it underwater, and it also doesn't match anything you do while racing. If you are hung up on body position while using a board, then I would recommend getting a FINIS alignment kickboard and using a FINIS snorkel with it. (And no, I am not a paid FINIS rep.)

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Elaine Krugman — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 02:21:53 GMT

It is a very long storey. I have written about it many times. Lots of mileage as a kid and a teen. Lots of cycling, lots of running... Was a middle distance swimmer until age of 17. Sick then started swimming sprints. Used technique with very little swimming. Played lots of waterpolo. Had many ups and downs never won a medal at the Olympics. Won a Silver at the Pan Am Games in 1955, beaten by Clarke Scholes. Became a Marathon Swimmer in 1963. Raced in marathon swims for about 10 years. Now that is when I trained hard, reason needed to win Money. OK, I'm with you on the value of cross training. I even found that when I got kicked out of the swim lane for the noodler's class at 9AM, there was actual value in joining their class for extra water time. :afraid: But, seriously, doing everything the lady on the CD said to do- but at triple the reps. to every noodler's one (if they were lucky) rep. really gave me a good extra workout. Now, waterpolo is an AWESOME way to train for swimming. It definitely builds endurance!

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Elaine Krugman — Thu, 30 Sep 2010 02:03:55 GMT

Variety is the spice of life, George. :applaud:

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 13:56:38 GMT

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 13:24:59 GMT

I did not use very much full stroke either.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 13:20:40 GMT

That picture is from 1954. The coach of the Canadian British Empire Games team had everybody using kick boards. I think I kicked 2 lengths of the pool. My favorite workout there was to let a shower run over my body for 2 hours 2X a day.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 12:32:58 GMT

It always made me happy when I saw people that I was going to race using gadgets. The worst thing they could use - a kickboard. Next a Pull Bouy. I also never wore goggles for sprinting. Needed goggles for lake swimming or ocean swimming. I have always said I prefer full stroke over all gadgets.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 11:05:57 GMT

Why do you want to use a snorkel? It is a fun word to write though.

RE: Help me learn to love my snorkel

Former Member — Wed, 29 Sep 2010 09:47:31 GMT

Why in the world would anyone want to use a snorkel. Can it be used in a race?? Will it really help you?? It would help if you are looking for fish. Snorkles are about as useless as swim paddles, kickboards, or fins.