New Start

RE: New Start

orca1946 — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 12:19:56 GMT

We used to call it the Gargoyle start . Grab the side & lean out as far as you can without falling in. It also made me feel as if I could not get my hands out in front on time. I now use the grab between my legs start.

RE: New Start

Former Member — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:56:13 GMT

An excellant level of trash talking! My best buddy through high school and I competed day and night in everything from swimming, surfing, chinups, parcheesi --- didn't matter what it was, it was a blood sport. Unwritten rules of trash talking were to lay off the other guys family, and . . . . hmmmm . . ummmhhhh??? .... guess that was about the only limit. The only time we'd let up is when we were on a relay together, then all derogatory statements shifted to our soon to be humbled opponents.:applaud:

RE: New Start

Stevepowell — Tue, 16 Feb 2010 09:20:51 GMT

What the arms back start got me:

RE: New Start

Chris Stevenson — Thu, 11 Feb 2010 01:37:05 GMT

Now THIS is some trash-talking. I need to take notes.

RE: New Start

Glenn — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 10:43:53 GMT

Bob, If you don't go to Atlanta, you are just making it easier for Allen. And guidance? I don't need no stinking guidance. Unless it is about how to jump on a relay...............:D

RE: New Start

Allen Stark — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:12:02 GMT

Bob, Great post! I have to say you are the breastroke king and there is nothing I can ever do to change that.:bow: However, you write in your post that you will remain slower than Rich but faster than me......... A correction is in order here. The last time I looked you remained slower than me in the 50 free. Get used to it. With the weight training I am now doing, by the time we get to Atlanta you will be lucky to swim in my wake.:banana: What about the 50 fly??

RE: New Start

Robert Strand — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:04:39 GMT

Atlanta seems out for me at this point, Glenn. Can you get it done without my guidence and support??? Iffy!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!at best.

RE: New Start

Glenn — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 08:57:21 GMT

RE: New Start

Allen Stark — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 08:57:13 GMT

Glenn- "Let sleeping Dogs lay around getting tan"!!!!! I have decided to take it easy the rest of the year. Planning to work with Rich Abrahams on sprinting (obivously will remain slower the Rich but faster then you) and will unvail my new form and speed next year at age 65. Its all very hush-hush , kind of a "black-ops" program but the results will be amazing. In the meantime I suggest you try to learn how to swim breastroke. Glenn has thrown down the gauntlet and you must respond.I suggest you devote yourself entirely to the 50 free and rest on your laurels in BR until you turn 65.

RE: New Start

Robert Strand — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 08:42:55 GMT

RE: New Start

Glenn — Wed, 10 Feb 2010 06:14:54 GMT

I read the article and it is worth the read. I tried the start today and I like it! I do get the feeling that I do not get out as far, but with the forward lean on the blocks, you are certainly ahead of where you would be if you did the track start or grab start and your center of gravity is farther back. Strand, if you are reading this, forget about this start for you, you won't like it! It won't get you any closer to beating me in the 50 free than you are now. Just be satisfied with silver.:D

RE: New Start

Rich Abrahams — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 11:54:03 GMT

Alan, I agree with Chris that this start has been around since the seventies. If you remember the blocks at Indy, they have slightly elevated rails on the sides for this purpose. I don't think starters like it very much because it can take longer to get set. I experimented with this start ages ago but, for me, the key to a good start is the correct body position and angle of entry that causes the least amount of resistance, not who is first to hit the water. When I enter the water correctly (which is very rare for me in a race) I feel an amazing sensation of acceleration. The best 50 free I ever had in masters I had one of those starts. I realized instantaneously that that sensation was like nothing I'd felt before. Unfortunately, It only happens rarely in races. I'm not alone in this even among the best. I remember a post Olympic Trials interview with Garret Weber-Gale who was also bemoaning his lack of consistancy in nailing his entry. Rich

RE: New Start

Former Member — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 11:39:06 GMT

When did the start disappear where you hold your arms behind you and swing them down at the gun/buzzer? I've been trying out these grab-track starts and don't feel comfortable with them. I think Park did that one when he won the 400 free final in beijin.

RE: New Start

Allen Stark — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 11:31:36 GMT

I tried it today.It was definitely faster off the block and felt easy.I need to get someone to time me to 15 Yd to see if it faster.

RE: New Start

Patrick W. Brundage — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 05:09:31 GMT

I experimented with this start ages ago but, for me, the key to a good start is the correct body position and angle of entry that causes the least amount of resistance, not who is first to hit the water. When I enter the water correctly (which is very rare for me in a race) I feel an amazing sensation of acceleration. The best 50 free I ever had in masters I had one of those starts. I realized instantaneously that that sensation was like nothing I'd felt before. Unfortunately, It only happens rarely in races. I'm not alone in this even among the best. I remember a post Olympic Trials interview with Garret Weber-Gale who was also bemoaning his lack of consistancy in nailing his entry.These discussions are precisely why I prefer events like the 400 IM & 500 free or more ... the start really (at our level of competition) just doesn't have that big of an impact on the race. Given my exceedingly slow reaction time, I'm going to be slow off the blocks no matter where I grab the blocks. When did the start disappear where you hold your arms behind you and swing them down at the gun/buzzer? I've been trying out these grab-track starts and don't feel comfortable with them.I remember my buddy and I doing this at an age group championship meet when we were age groupers and getting lambasted by our coach. It was fun, though. Remember doing starts where, after a nice pike, you threw a little air kick in before hitting the water? When I think back to some of the resistance-adding things I did as a youngster, it amazes me how hard it is to swim as fast now as I did then.

RE: New Start

Chris Stevenson — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 04:57:59 GMT

The new issue of the ASCA magazine demonstrates a start like the grab start except you grab the block on the side about even with your ankles and lean forward as far as you can.The article says it is about .3 sec faster.I haven't tried it yet,have any of you? Nothing is new under the sun, I remember that one from the 70s. I vaguely recall that I wouldn't get as much "lift" in the start -- I wouldn't get out as far -- as the regular grab start (which is what I still use). Since not all blocks are the same width, I remember that being an issue too. It was also harder to stand back up when the starter asked it. I wish they wouldn't focus so much on reaction time off the blocks, but instead report how long it takes to get out to (say) 10m. A dive is more than just reaction.

RE: New Start

Chris Stevenson — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 04:47:04 GMT

When did the start disappear where you hold your arms behind you and swing them down at the gun/buzzer? I think maybe mid-70s. I think the main problem was slow reaction time. Balance might be an issue too. But I saw a masters swimmer do that start in a meet not too long ago, I don't think he had the flexibility to bend all the way down for a grab start. I still do that start for relay exchanges, where you can anticipate the touch and time the swing better. You do whatever works. If you like that start, go for it.

RE: New Start

Stevepowell — Tue, 09 Feb 2010 04:18:11 GMT

When did the start disappear where you hold your arms behind you and swing them down at the gun/buzzer? I've been trying out these grab-track starts and don't feel comfortable with them.