Deep catch

RE: Deep catch

Former Member — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 06:45:56 GMT

You hit the nail on the head - When swimmers understand what they need to do, coaches and swimmers can experiment until they get the results they're looking for. It's like life "An experiment". Have a great summer! Thanks for the video clips Tom! Good stuff for swimmers to understand - and experiment with their coaches and or team mates in workouts.

RE: Deep catch

knelson — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 03:12:26 GMT

Every swimmer needs to extend their arms and at that point of extension an EVF comes sooner with a bent arm and later with a straight arm but neither world class swimmer drops their elbow (the opposite of an EVF). Right. The bottom line is you want your fingers pointed at the bottom of the pool for as long in the pull cycle as possible. I think the main reason sprinters like Bernard prefer a straighter arm pull as opposed to the style seen in the video of Hackett is they don't want to slow their arms down. They want to keep the momentum going.They might be sacrificing some pulling power in the front part of the stroke, but they are making up for this in increased turnover rate.

RE: Deep catch

Ahelee Sue Osborn — Fri, 19 Jun 2009 01:56:39 GMT

Thanks for the video clips Tom! Good stuff for swimmers to understand - and experiment with their coaches and or team mates in workouts.

RE: Deep catch

knelson — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 12:19:27 GMT

I guess I don't know for sure. Just speculation. I would think a deep catch means immediately driving your arm down and pulling straight back rather than leaving it out front and then pulling while keeping your elbow high. I don't see this as pushing down at the entry, but rather driving the hand down or "slicing" through the water and then initiating the pull with a straighter arm.

RE: Deep catch

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 11:48:27 GMT

The depth and angle/rotation (from the shoulder to the elbow) will be different for every swimmer. Alain Bernard has a very deep and straight-arm catch and on the other extreme Rebecca Addlington has a very shallow and bent-arm, both are very successful swimmers. The pulling pattern that is best for you is determined by timing your 25's and deciding which pattern is the fastest and most efficient. Stay away from pulling patterns that scull toward the mid-line before a catch (straight or bent) is established. Every swimmer needs to extend their arms and at that point of extension an EVF comes sooner with a bent arm and later with a straight arm but neither world class swimmer drops their elbow (the opposite of an EVF). A shoulder that lacks muscular balance necessary to stabalize the joint is prone to tendonitis and/or bursitis. Shoulder pain should be attributed to a muscular imbalance or weakness and must be looked at as a warning sign that says: "STOP". Even a twing of pain in the shoulder tells you that you're not ready or need to adjust your pulling pattern (including how you exit or recover you hand/arm). A weight training regime that includes religious shoulder-cuff strengthening exercises is a must for every swimmer. I suggest letting a coach who's forte is stroke mechanics watch you swim for a while and let them give you some ideas. Here are some good sites dealing with the catch or EVF. Good luck, Coach T. Total Immersion EVF Video YouTube - How to swim with a High Elbow Catch/EVF - Total Immersion Israel Underwater EVF (Catch) Technique YouTube - SwimTherapy - Frontcrawl Catch EVF Article - The Holy Grail to Fast Swimming www.swimmingcoach.org/.../EVFbyTomTopolskiSMALL.pdf Underwater Swimming Techniques YouTube - Underwater Swimming Techniques Grant Hackett Swimming Technique YouTube - Grant Hackett Front Crawl Technique A lot of my EVF Videos www.youtube.com/.../tomtopo I'd love to see a video of the difference too. Anybody have a link to a clip?

RE: Deep catch

orca1946 — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 07:12:23 GMT

Yeah , a video is needed to resolves the question.

RE: Deep catch

Zurn — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 06:13:07 GMT

I'd love to see a video of the difference too. Anybody have a link to a clip?

RE: Deep catch

ViveBene — Thu, 18 Jun 2009 06:04:21 GMT

A deep catch seems to be what the most recent set of coaching instructions has encouraged me to do. It solved the problem of 5 different angles my arm was composing itself into at any one time, does not cause pain, and is faster and more powerful. (Also, it "feels" like swimming.) Hand slices into water at usual angle to begin stroke, then forearm drops/presses down to roughly a 45-degree angle (in my case) from surface with elbow held stationary, at which point (45 degree forearm) the catch proper is initiated. So it is like a long press approach to the catch. And I'm sure this particular technique will change over time. I do not have much shoulder girdle flexibility and wing span is less than body height, altho' those factors may be unrelated to trying to use a deep catch at this point in my swimming efforts. YMMV. :)

RE: Deep catch

Former Member — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 15:11:16 GMT

I thought "deep catch" meant that you do not start applying force after entry until your hand is several inches farther below the water surface (and positioned with the fingers pointing at the pool bottom, elbow higher than hand). I found it easy on the shoulders as you are not pressing down on the water immediately on entry, also no dropped elbow. This is what I always thought a deep catch was. Do we have a real definition? Maybe a video clip of a proper catch?

RE: Deep catch

Former Member — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 12:28:20 GMT

RE: Deep catch

Former Member — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 11:16:52 GMT

It means keep your arm nearly straight during the pull. nearly straight = dropper elbow so it don't look a great move, even more if you've long arms, only maybe with a Bernard-like arm it can be a good move or with a very short arm, like a 5-5/5-7 women, Lenton/trickett use a deep pull but she's a on the short side, his elbow is still very high due at his "short" upper arm. My :2cents:

RE: Deep catch

orca1946 — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:27:40 GMT

This causes you to push down @ the start of the stroke , rather than pull you forward as in the bent arm pull thru.

RE: Deep catch

orca1946 — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 07:11:27 GMT

This will bring on shoulder problems with this .

RE: Deep catch

knelson — Wed, 17 Jun 2009 04:45:47 GMT

It means keep your arm nearly straight during the pull.