Men are faster in short distances

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:26:18 GMT

Here is another analysis: If we index the world record times of freestyle events as 100, here are the results: (LCM) For female swimmers: -------------------50m. 100m. 200m. freestyle(index)--- 100---100---100 butterfly---------- 106---106---109 backstroke-------- 117---112---110 breaststroke------ 126----122---122 for male swimmers: -------------------50m. 100m. 200m. free(index)-------- 100-- 100-- 100 butterf.----------- 106-- 105-- 108 back-------------- 115-- 111-- 110 ***.------------ 126-- 124-- 124 Here are my conclusions: butterfly is very fast in 50 and 100, but lose pace with distance (as expected) backstroke is slow in 50, but the gap decreases wth the distance (I think mainly the start of backstroke is a handicap an its effect is more in shorter distance) breaststroke has a relatively constant correlation with freestyle and it is approx. 25% slower than free.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Allen Stark — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 09:51:42 GMT

Come on Chris,just because you don't walk like a duck is no reason to insult those of us who do.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Chris Stevenson — Sun, 24 Feb 2008 04:18:48 GMT

breaststroke has a relatively constant correlation with freestyle and it is approx. 25% slower than free. CLEARLY it doesn't belong with the others. When will they wise up and send it to join the trudgeon crawl? Nice job on the analysis, it is interesting.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Allen Stark — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 11:34:43 GMT

funny you say that. I recall John Trembley (coaching at Mercersburg acadamy at the time) saying that at some point in the not too distant future, women will be faster than men in breastroke. This was 1982 or 83. One must put this quote on context.1983 was before the rule change allowing your head to stay underwater.female swimmers such as Tracy Caulkins had developed a style requiring a level of back flexibility that few men have.Also the East German women had more androgens than most men.I still think that the reason this calculation shows women closer to men in breaststroke is that Liesel is freakishly fast.Compare the # 2s(Kitajima to Hardy) and I get 11.4.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sat, 23 Feb 2008 10:49:48 GMT

Allen, you are right. My analysis is very simple. I took the world records only. To have a deeper analysis, we shall take the top 10 records to minimize these kind of problems.;)

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 10:50:57 GMT

I think it means I swim the stroke I do well in.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 10:31:21 GMT

I made another analysis. It is related to the choice of events. In 2006 World Masters Champs, both men and women chose freestyle events most. If we index the average number of participants in each freestyle event as 100, in womens races, number of participants in each breaststroke event is 82, backstroke 64, IM 62 and butterfly 55 in mens races, breaststroke 91, butterfly 83, IM and backstroke 65 each.It means most people love freestyle and breaststroke, men like butterfly events, but women hate butterfly

RE: Men are faster in short distances

pwolf66 — Fri, 22 Feb 2008 06:23:56 GMT

I recall John Trembley (coaching at Mercersburg acadamy at the time) saying that at some point in the not too distant future, women will be faster than men in breastroke. This was 1982 or 83. Ah, brings up my biggest regret in life. Not choosing Mercersburg over the high school I did attend. I would have been swimming for John with that program if I had. Instead I choose a school that didn't even have a pool. Ah well.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 14:41:15 GMT

Considering the average of 50, 100 and 200 of 4 events, largest gap is in backstroke (12.2%), butterfly (11.7%), free (11.4%) and *** (10.3%). Very interesting analysis. Maybe this is some sort of proof of how important technigue is vs pure muscle power. Breaststroke being considered by many as the most difficult one to master technically. If technique is a relatively bigger factor for success in breaststroke than in the other strokes then that could explain why the difference is smaller since everyone can potentially master technique...no matter how much muscle power you have. also...Femal (knee) joints may be more flexible (i know they are during pregnancy at least) which might lead to a more efficient kick. my :2cents: /Per

RE: Men are faster in short distances

art_z — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 09:47:34 GMT

It is also interesting to see that the gap is narrow in breaststroke. This style needs a lot of power. But, as well as I know breaststroke is the style that contribution of legs is most important. Can we conclude that womens' legs are powerful, making the gap narrower? funny you say that. I recall John Trembley (coaching at Mercersburg acadamy at the time) saying that at some point in the not too distant future, women will be faster than men in breastroke. This was 1982 or 83.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Chris Stevenson — Thu, 21 Feb 2008 04:30:07 GMT

I take solace in the fact that Speedo makes me look exactly like a man in my FSII body suit. Last year when I first asked a local age-group coach about the advantages of technical suits, he thought for a minute and then replied "Their biggest advantage is probably that they give women swimmers the bodies they had as 14-year olds." He was too polite to say something like "it also gives aging masters swimmers, such as yourself, a body closer the one they had in college."

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 12:04:12 GMT

This LZR would look fine on any woman, www.slashgear.com/world-fastest-swimmer-crowned-member-of-speedo-lzr-racer-1910326.php

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 11:29:00 GMT

With Speedo's great product design team in place, I think that they recognize the value of at least having us women look like the men since we can't keep up with them. I take solace in the fact that Speedo makes me look exactly like a man in my FSII body suit. If you can't beat 'em, join 'em! :laugh2::laugh2:

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:52:51 GMT

Fort just give me the facts. Why men are better - www.survivalmonkey.com/.../APPA.PDF Don't forget (S)he-Man!!! :weightlifter: Men have bigger hearts and lungs and testosterone. Other than that, they can't compete with women. :)

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:05:24 GMT

Very few women could compete with men in marathon races. There were a few who would occasionally be up with the men under all conditions. But they were never consistent. In cold water some did very well. Greta Anderson did do well in any conditions but never beat the top men in any conditions. Judy Denyse also could be up with the men in any conditions and was very tough. They beat many of the great warm water marathon swimmers in cold water. Women in general not able to compete with the men. I'm heading for the nearest fallout shelter. :bolt:

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 10:01:14 GMT

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 09:18:32 GMT

Careful comparing open water swimming between men and women. The events are HIGHLY variable in terms of conditions and cold water plays different effects on core temperatures with different fat levels. You may be measuring insulation more than endurance. I'd stick Hackett or Vendt against ANY female in the world in a 20-40 mile race and even bet my house if the wave conditions were equal for competitors and temperature above 70 degrees...... i.e. a purely endurance comparison. Also remember the law of small numbers. It takes less effect to make a higher percentage change with small numbers than larger numbers. John Smith

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:52:35 GMT

The information about marathon swims is very interesting. I also checked the correlation of the paces between 50-100-200 meter events. Decrease in the pace with the increasing distance is much higher in mens events. It means women have better endurance, it is very clear.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Allen Stark — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 08:16:06 GMT

One could as easily say the bodysuits make the men look like the women,not a problem in briefs.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

The Fortress — Wed, 20 Feb 2008 05:42:36 GMT

Women in general not able to compete with the men. Don't forget (S)he-Man!!! :weightlifter: Men have bigger hearts and lungs and testosterone. Other than that, they can't compete with women. :)

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 16:57:23 GMT

Or maybe men just have short attention spans, poor things. :D :thhbbb: I forgot what my point was when you mentioned women's legs...

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 14:26:08 GMT

No real surprizes here, it's long been known that men are faster in the short distances and that the gap closes most of all in ultra-endurance type events. Women have held the overall record for the English Channel and other very long swims from time to time and may again. A runner named Ann Trason was overall winner of the 1994 Leadville 100 mile trail race, and a British cyclist named Beryl Burton, who had a very long and illustrious career, was the overall winner and new record setter for the British 12-hour cycling championship, in 1966 I think it was. As for *** stroke, yes women have very strong legs, probably because we have to carry so much weight on them with pregnancy and childcare. The long and tedious aspects of childcare may explain the ability to do endurance events. Or maybe men just have short attention spans, poor things. :D :thhbbb:

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 14:21:42 GMT

Can we conclude that womens' legs are powerful, making the gap narrower? OK...I'll bite. Not being a breaststroker...here's a theory. It's a short axis stroke which involves frontal resistance. Most men have a larger upper torso than the ladies...and therefore have more body mass to act as an obstacle to on coming water. Women being a bit slighter (and not as top heavy) might have less surface area pushing on the water when they lunge forward...and therefore less drag from frontal resistance. Thus the narrower gap in times for breaststroke events.

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Former Member — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 13:27:57 GMT

I just took 50 LCM world records into consideration. 50,100,200 all styles including 200 IM, 400 free and IM, 800, 1500 free. I think it is interesting that he largest gaps are in backstroke. It seems to me that butterfly needs more power. Maybe the reason is, butterfly needs a lot of body flexibility and women are more flexible. It is also interesting to see that the gap is narrow in breaststroke. This style needs a lot of power. But, as well as I know breaststroke is the style that contribution of legs is most important. Can we conclude that womens' legs are powerful, making the gap narrower?

RE: Men are faster in short distances

Iwannafly — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 11:40:28 GMT

A runner named Ann Trason was overall winner of the 1994 Leadville 100 mile trail race... Ann Trason also held the 24 hour world record for many years and beat the men year after year in the 24 hour championships (for running that is).