How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 15:16:14 GMT

Paul- Let me know how it goes......mine won't arrive for like 5-9 business days. Did you get the same model? -Julia

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

pwolf66 — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 10:25:49 GMT

Yep, Finis Shooter Mono in size Gorilla :groovy: Paul

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

pwolf66 — Thu, 27 Dec 2007 09:45:02 GMT

I'm trying mine out tomorrow. I have a feeling this is gonna hurt so good. Paul

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Wed, 26 Dec 2007 07:44:56 GMT

Ok.....just ordered a Finis Shooter Monofin (since Santa did not get it for me)....can't wait to try them. Really hope they improve my butterfly kick!

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 14:30:49 GMT

Richard your fly endurance does not come overnight. Varied workouts are very important. I would work on building the workouts up to 2500 to 3500m. When I started to swim again I did 3000m a day, after a 25 year lay off. In six weeks I was quite able to swim 50 and 100s of fly and crawl, in fairley good time. Build up first so you can handle the fly.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 13:48:10 GMT

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 12:10:37 GMT

I just joined masters. I swam fly in 1950. I am retracing my steps 57 years later. I normally swim about 1600 meters a workout. How do I build my fly endurance. I swam frog kick in 50 so this discussion very interesting. I swim in the 75-80 age group. I can inelegantly fly about 25 meters now. Any suggestions? I do 100 free in about 1'10" working out. You do a 100 free in 1:10 in the 75 - 80 age group. :groovy: I am full of awe and admiration. I want to be able to say that too when I am your age! Thank you for the inspiration. I have just recently started swimming fly and I have found doing long sets of 25's (alternating free and fly) helped a lot. At first 25 was all I could do until I lapsed into 'butterstruggle' so 25 was all I did. More recently I have expanded into sets 50's and 75's. My goal: to be able to do a set of 10 x 100 @ 2:00 and to compete in a 200m fly race. Another suggestion (and I think this came up in a TI thread) is to do a 500 and at the beginning of each length do as many butterfly strokes as you can before your stroke starts to break down. The rest do easy free. For instance: initially you might only be doing 3 strokes of fly at the beginning of each length and the rest free. As you get stronger, you build that up: 4 then 5, etc until eventually you are doing the entire distance fly. Check out this thread, too. forums.usms.org/showthread.php has some good info in it. Good luck with the fly and please tell us your progress. I would love to hear about it. And welcome to USMS! Syd

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

The Fortress — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 10:15:52 GMT

Thank you Fort......have been following the other threads, too, still spending $99 on something makes me think twice......on the other hand, I NEED work on my Dolphin kick in fly. The arm strength is there, but when I was a kid (did not swim for 35 years) it was the core strength that helped me swim butterfly. Really want to get that effortless feeling back into my fly so any prop that helps me reach that goal is money well spent! Funny how swimming after a 35 year break, you find that strokes you hated as a kid are now your best strokes, and strokes that were your strength back then are not so good now......and of course goals are different now. Swimming more for fitness (I don't think I'll ever see those times again) than competition. An MF is a big ticket item, but it was worth it for me. You can also work on your core strength with a serious dryland program. That will help your fly too. I try to forget all my youth times. They seem pretty irrelevant to me. We're just at a different place in life with different bodies. But I still suck at the same stroke I sucked at as a kid. No change there. :rofl:

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Richard P. Arnold — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 09:26:24 GMT

I apologize I meant a 2min 10 100 actually closer to 2min. So much for your inspiration, Last evening I swam eight fly 25s up, free back. I am tired today after doing that and a total of 1500 meters.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Richard P. Arnold — Thu, 11 Oct 2007 03:02:45 GMT

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

The Fortress — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 06:54:58 GMT

Am thinking of getting a monofin to help with my butterfly (mainly the dolphin kick.....) which model do you guys recommend? I don't about "expert" here. I'm just winging it and experimenting on my own. But I do love my MF and I can state with some certainty that it has helped my SDKs on back and fly and helped my starts. I can pop off a backstroke start underwater to 15 meters pretty regularly now. Plus, it's just a super fun toy. I use the $99 finis shooter designed for SDK/dolphin kick type work. Here's a thread on monofins: forums.usms.org/showthread.php

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 05:42:36 GMT

Fort is the expert on Mono Fins.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Wed, 10 Oct 2007 05:22:09 GMT

Am thinking of getting a monofin to help with my butterfly (mainly the dolphin kick.....) which model do you guys recommend?

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 16:57:48 GMT

forget about the dolphin for the time being. (assuming you are learning the freestyle!) I'm working on both the short axis (***/Fly) and long axis (Free/Back). I switch it up. I'm mostly doing drills designed to teach the needed skills. I don't do much whole stroke swimming now. (What would be the point-to practice lousy technique?)

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 16:40:39 GMT

My body dolphin is not too good now. I'm just a beginner. I think deep down you know the answer. If you are a beginner, forget about the dolphin for the time being. First things first (assuming you are learning the freestyle aka front crawl)! I'm such a wise guy...;)

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Tue, 09 Oct 2007 06:12:59 GMT

Here is a video of a drill done by Alexander Popov where he is practicing the dolphin vertical in the water. I really like this drill as you can feel a difference in the water resistance. After, when you go back to horizontal, you can better feel the water resistance and what's slowing you down. www.youtube.com/watch ---------------- Heath Twenty-Three Seconds for in-depth freestyle swimming analysis www.wbmny.com/swimming

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 12:06:50 GMT

Every thing is fine with me every thing mentioned here will work with time. I just don't want to spend more than a hour teaching the butterfly. After learning the movements it is going to be a work in progress. Throw away all your DVDs and get a coach. When you hit 50 seconds for a 100m then you will finally find out you have it right. I still have a long way to go to reach that time. My best time about 1 minute for the 100m lc was nearly 50 years ago. When we start to do 50 seconds for the 100 the goal then will be 40 seconds. Learning goes on forever.. 13 days to go Mexico Here I come, we leve for Mexico October 20.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

The Fortress — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 12:00:11 GMT

I just do not like to see anything done from a complete stop it is hard to get a continuous fluid motion. I will admit to pushing off the wall, coming almost -- but not quite -- to a semi-halt and then starting the chest presss. :laugh2:

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 11:12:54 GMT

I also do the drill George suggests. But I call it chest press fly. Arms at the side, doing the body dolphin, leading with the head, pressing with the chest. Last time my coach saw me doing this in warm up, she said I was very TI... The Head Lead Body Dolphin is Drill Numero Uno of the "Butterfly and Breaststroke: The TI Way" tape (Now found combined with the old "Freestyle and Backstroke" tape on the "Four Strokes Made Easy" DVD. www.totalimmersion.net/four-strokes-details.html ) The Hand Lead Body Dolphin is Drill Number 2. This DVD is currently my main instructional source for learning how to swim.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 08:23:08 GMT

I never did very many drills. I know a lot of them. I guess I was lucky I had no trouble doing the fly. I just brought my arms out clean entered clean, one big kick one little kick. Head went in and it was very natural for me. I di not have to think about it. Did a few one length and two lengths sprints, under water dolphin kicks with the hands at my side. I raced the crawl sprinters from our club. But most of my fly training was to swim a couple of endless relays at our club. When i dove in off the racing block I did the dolphin kick with the hands out front, not moving the head and shoulders, but moved everything below the shoulders. In a nutshell, head and chest go down, hips and legs go up, then thrust the hips down and I am doing the dolphin kick. All I can say is keep it simple, don't make it complicated.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

The Fortress — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 08:05:34 GMT

The Head Lead Body Dolphin is Drill Numero Uno of the "Butterfly and Breaststroke: The TI Way" tape (Now found combined with the old "Freestyle and Backstroke" tape on the "Four Strokes Made Easy" DVD. www.totalimmersion.net/four-strokes-details.html ) The Hand Lead Body Dolphin is Drill Number 2. This DVD is currently my main instructional source for learning how to swim. Well, I already know how to swim. LOL. I still find it useful to do these drills a bit every workout to reinforce proper technique. Since I've never even seen these DVDs, the fact that I'm apparently swimming very TI only reinforces my opinion that shoulder injuries are not due to solely to poor technique. :thhbbb: :mooning: :dedhorse: Since you've already found these sources, Tom, once you've got a decent body motion going, I'd grab that monofin and go. Even TI Dave uses a monofin when he's not pottering about in the OW, right Dave? And practice! This motion takes awhile to really get.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 06:27:29 GMT

I just do not like to see anything done from a complete stop it is hard to get a continuous fluid motion. hence the challenge. like riding a bike: those with the best balance (think track stand) don't need any motion to stay upright, but most people can fake it if they're rolling.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sun, 07 Oct 2007 05:32:05 GMT

i got the most improvement in my dolphin kick by doing kick drills on my back (along the surface) w/o a kick board. it felt REALLY awkward at first, and the head tends to stay in place (which is not necessarily true in fly), but eventually i found a groove, and things have improved a lot since then. this sdk thread has a number of coolbeans vid links. one thing i've found interesting is that in the SDK (streamlined dolphin kick) the head pretty much stays in place. in fly it tends to follow the sine wave motion of the stroke (but i'm finding in fly practice now that the flatter the "wave" the better). as with a lot of things, high frequency wave forms seem to be more efficient than low frequency ones (like twisted-pair telephone wires vs. fiber optics). if you can watch vids in QuickTime you can step them one frame at a time. i found this to be amazingly useful in analyzing strokes of the experts. this youtube download thread may help. expert \`ek-spert\ n - "x" = the unknown factor, "spurt" = a drip under pressure. :-) at this point i'm beginning to truly understand that you can't be tense in fly (i reckon the same applies to SDK). as i see it now, that is the ultimate hat trick (hey rocky! watch me pull a rabbit outta my hat!), knowing when to flex, and when to relax, and the changes are fast (which is a real challenge for those aging fast twitch muscle fibers). while i'm still testing it, i also recently discovered that if i kick in a slightly knock-knee (ankles wider) position it allows me to get more power as the top of my foot is flatter (so less slippage in the biggest power portion of the kick). hip flexibility (relaxation) is needed here for the legs to be able to turn that way. there are a lot of Yoga asanas (postures) that will help increase flexibility and strength in the pelvic region. ankle flexibility seems really critical too. swim.ee used to have a vid called "Frolander-flexible-legkicks" this guy is a rubber band! my fly sets now mostly consist of kick out (as described above) and fly back, catch my breath, repeat (but i'm a bit of a lightweight... relative to many posters here). my facility is SCY (25yds). in the earlier part of my fly practice/study i discovered i was really getting a deeper understanding of the body motion when i was able to start doing fly from a dead stop. this was a HUGE breakthrough discovery/moment for me. if you are interested in doing fly... try these two articles by Coach Emmett Hines, they helped me a lot: Slip-Slid’n’ Away Vive le Papillon! (or Is There Fly After 25?)

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sat, 06 Oct 2007 16:58:50 GMT

I never use anything false. 3strokes way is the way i do it. When the hands are there i use them in an up and down motion for balance.

RE: How Can I Make My Body Dolphin Better?

Former Member — Sat, 06 Oct 2007 16:55:34 GMT

Just my :2cents: I found that I get a better feel for what the whole dolphin motion is about when I do it with my arms by my side, a la "Man from Atlantis". I actually go faster, farther with less effort, than with with the arms extended to the front (upper arms over ears, so to speak).