100 Fly Predictions

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Wed, 04 Apr 2007 16:00:32 GMT

I felt the need to google pictures of Crocker to prove that he is no where near fat or chubby or anything of the sort ... albums.mouseplanet.com/.../024_100504_fa.jpg Speedo has this one up for awhile ... www.ian-crocker.com/.../header.jpg img78.echo.cx/.../ian24jb.jpg And my work here is done ... IMHO and taste, I would take Crocker over Phelps any day of the week. And I if Crocker is chubby then God help me come bikini season!!:rofl:

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 16:45:42 GMT

It's dangerous to compare era's,so much has changed.Spitz swam before the mega-yardage explosion of the mid-70s.Training is different,the strokes are taught differently,SDK etc. Spitz was great,Phelps is great. Phelps may be the greatest of all time.He certainly had a better first Olympics than Spitz did. I thought Phelps did rather poorly at his first Olympics?

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 16:21:34 GMT

It looked to me like Crocker just didn't time the wall as well as usual, he had a full meter of glide while Phelps finished his stroke closer to the wall with less glide.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 16:02:32 GMT

how did crocker lose? www.youtube.com/watch look at the video, on the finish crocker bends his arms in and it almost looks like he slows down on purpose. Iv been watching alot of videos of crooker and he never finishes like that. Kind of looks like the race was fixed. I'm not saying it was fixed becasue there is no way that would happen. But what was crocker doing?

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 15:28:24 GMT

I felt the need to google pictures of Crocker to prove that he is no where near fat or chubby or anything of the sort ... albums.mouseplanet.com/.../024_100504_fa.jpg Speedo has this one up for awhile ... www.ian-crocker.com/.../header.jpg img78.echo.cx/.../ian24jb.jpg And my work here is done ... Crocker may not be ripped but he is not fat, at least IMHO.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 14:48:26 GMT

Crocker's swim in Montreal was amazing, his 50m split was faster than Athens or Melbourne, he didn't die at the end, and he was less than a foot from the wall when he finished his stroke. Thanks for the video link, I saw that race in person, it is great to see the replay.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Jeff Commings — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 12:58:18 GMT

I thought Phelps did rather poorly at his first Olympics? He got fifth, yes, but he was: only 15 years old racing guys who had been in this situation before used a much different race strategy that would not get him world records today. On the upside, he did swim a best time in Sydney. The following year, he broke the world record and never looked back. Now, about this supposed "race fixing" by Crocker. He didn't fix the race. Don't be daft (as the Brits say). He was trying to time that last stroke right, and doing it at the normal speed would have meant a longer glide. As in breaststroke, the hardest thing about the race is timing the finish. Both guys had long glides to the wall. Michael's just got him to the finish .05 seconds quicker.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Allen Stark — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 12:44:15 GMT

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Rob Copeland — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 12:33:22 GMT

Interesting observation Lindsey. I don't know if that makes Phelps greater...but it sure shows how much has changed in the world of swimming (in terms of times and what not) since the days of Mark Spitz.Spitz’s times in 1972 • 100 m freestyle: 51.22 (world record) 1st • 200 m freestyle: 1:52.78 (world record) 1st • 100 m butterfly: 54.27 (world record) 1st • 200 m butterfly: 2:00.70 (world record) 1st Those times at worlds 2007 • 100 m freestyle: 51.22 61st • 200 m freestyle: 1:52.78 55th • 100 m butterfly: 54.27 37th • 200 m butterfly: 2:00.70 27th

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

knelson — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 12:10:13 GMT

If he can beat Scott Lautman 200 fly record in the 50-54 age group, then he will be great! Rob, I'll let Scott know that beating his record is now the standard to be considered "greatest swimmer ever!" :)

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

FlyQueen — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 11:22:29 GMT

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 09:00:24 GMT

This looks almost exactly like the Olympic 100 Fly Final is Athens. Crocker lost by .04 and this time by .05 and both times it was the finish. It is similar in that Phelps caught Crocker by a hair at the finish but Crocker's finish was very different, in Athens he took one last quick stroke, in Melbourne he did a long glide to the wall. In Athens Crocker visibly fell apart in the last few strokes, in Melbourne he slowed down but didn't appear to loose form, at least not to the same extent, as Warren said his arms were a little unstreamlined on the final arm entry. I'll bet though that if Phelps hadn't had the 50.77 breakthrough and Crocker did the exact same swim that people would be saying it was a great swim, 50.82 is not that shabby.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 08:34:13 GMT

I think Lochte will upend Phelps in at least one of the IMs, probably the 2 ... I don't doubt that at all but it's going to be huge when it happens.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 06:48:32 GMT

I was mostly trying to convey that Spitz did far better his first time out than Phelps did since somebody else claimed the opposite. I am not taking anything away from Phelps at all.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 06:09:31 GMT

Spitz swam his first Olympics in 1968. He was 18 yrs. old. His medal count was much more impressive than Phelps first Olympics - but as someone already pointed out Phelps was just 15. The criticism of Spitz's first Olympics was that he predicted six gold medals for himself but he earned "just" four medals - golds only in relays. So against expectations Spitz's first Olympics was a disappointment. For Phelps there was no such expectation. He was the youngest US Olympian since 1932. I was always impressed that Spitz took the disappointment of the 1968 and turned it into his medal explosion of 1972. But I think Phelps is already a better swimmer all around than anyone in the world. His achievements are already gigantic. When a Top 10 list of greatest male swimmers is created Phelps will be on top today and after the 2008 Olympics.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Frank Thompson — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 05:36:03 GMT

It is similar in that Phelps caught Crocker by a hair at the finish but Crocker's finish was very different, in Athens he took one last quick stroke, in Melbourne he did a long glide to the wall. In Athens Crocker visibly fell apart in the last few strokes, in Melbourne he slowed down but didn't appear to loose form, at least not to the same extent, as Warren said his arms were a little unstreamlined on the final arm entry. I'll bet though that if Phelps hadn't had the 50.77 breakthrough and Crocker did the exact same swim that people would be saying it was a great swim, 50.82 is not that shabby. Lindsay: True the finishes were very different. It just seems that Crocker does something at the finish to lose the race. The same thing happened in 2005 at the World Championship Trial in Indianapolis. From the angle it looked like Crocker won but he didn't. They were both going for the pads and Phelps got there quicker. Here, Crocker has a great finish and Phelps takes the extra stroke. www.youtube.com/watch

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Allen Stark — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 05:18:07 GMT

I don't know where I left my brain when I forgot Phelps made the Olympic team in 2000:dunno: Crocker swam a great 100 fly and missed his finish just a little. I hope he can shake this meet off and use it as motivation for next year.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 05:08:15 GMT

I doubt Phelps would want a medal on the back of a gimme...

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 05:01:23 GMT

But his first Olympics was not any better than that of Spitz, quite the contrary as a matter of fact.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

FlyQueen — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 04:31:17 GMT

I'll also admit to being a huge Michael Phelps fan and have been since watching the 2000 Trials! :o Gee Carrie, why is that? :dunno: :rofl: I will go on record that I think Crocker will win the 100 fly in Beijing ... I also predict Peirsol will go on a tear, break the 200 record before Beijing and nab both backstrokes, again ... I think Lochte will upend Phelps in at least one of the IMs, probably the 2 ... I like Mike, too.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Frank Thompson — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 04:30:35 GMT

It looked to me like Crocker just didn't time the wall as well as usual, he had a full meter of glide while Phelps finished his stroke closer to the wall with less glide. Warren/Lindsay: This looks almost exactly like the Olympic 100 Fly Final is Athens. Crocker lost by .04 and this time by .05 and both times it was the finish. www.youtube.com/watch

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

poolraat — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 04:16:25 GMT

I'll also admit to being a huge Michael Phelps fan and have been since watching the 2000 Trials! :o Wait 'til you see my fly. You'll have a new hero.:rofl:

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

aquaFeisty — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 02:49:48 GMT

I'll also admit to being a huge Michael Phelps fan and have been since watching the 2000 Trials! :o

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

aquaFeisty — Tue, 03 Apr 2007 02:45:20 GMT

I wouldn't call Phelps' first Olympics a poor one. Not only was he only 15, he had just turned 15. He went his lifetime best at Trials prelims, came back in the semis and bettered it, came back in finals to better it again and make the team. I seem to recall he was 5th or 7th at the wall for the final turn before bringing it home to hit 2nd. With the time he had coming into those Trials, he had no chance of making the team. At the Games, you guessed it, more lifetime bests. Pretty impressive, I'd say. Especially when you look at pictures of him and how rail-thin and little-boy looking he was at the time.

RE: 100 Fly Predictions

Former Member — Fri, 30 Mar 2007 14:54:08 GMT

I noticed that as well. Subirats and Cielo made the transition to long course very well. Both are going to be tough to beat in China.