Clarifying Lane Etiquette

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:50:08 GMT

I'll take the contrary view here. All pools should require circle swimming all the time. What you do by insisting to swim side by side, or down the center, is make the next person entering the lane stop you and ask for permission and work out a plan you can accept. Circle swimming is the most efficient use of a finite space. Assuming this is public pool space so whether you develop a bad habit of circle swimming in races shouldn't be the concern of the owner of the pool. Their concern should be to fit as many people in the space as they can.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:34:56 GMT

....I wouldn't have had any problems, but I kept getting my ankle grabbed so I moved aside at turns for him.... It is fairly common practice to tap someone’s foot to indicate the intention to pass, but if you were being grabbed I’d consider that unacceptably rude behavior that should be corrected (either by you or the pool staff). It does indeed seem like this person was trying to bully you out of “their” lane. No one wants to split a wall lane and get the wall side, but there is no good excuse (IMHO) for how this person was treating you. At the very least you should inquire about the situation with the pool staff so they are aware that there is a potential problem. I’ve done quite a bit of research on lane sharing etiquette and there is no clear cut universal “right” policy, so your best bet is to check with the resident lifeguard or pool staff for the policy there in these situations. I believe the USMS web has some articles on lane sharing rules, as do a few other webs (try Googling the subject, or searching the archives here if you want to know more). A fairly recent copy of the USMS magazine had an article on the subject, but the following issue had to publish a correction, which is pretty indicative of the various (sometimes-vague) schools of thought on the process. So some confusion should be expected, especially when frequently sharing lanes with strangers, since there is more than one idea out there regarding what is correct. http://www.usms.org/articles/ www.google.com/search forums.usms.org/search.php (There are also Forum and Thread search links near the top of each message page.)

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:31:17 GMT

The guy was obviously silly-wrong to insist on circling. Did he forget how to swim straight? Worried that some cute guy might show up and be afraid to get in with the two of you? Who knows, but maybe he had some weird reason that you'd rather not know! Next time either don't stop for him to pass as it sounds like he was plenty fast enough to get around, or don't stress out about having to stop and instead have some fun with it - do some speed work trying to stay on his feet for 25 each time he passes you, something like that. It's boring and unimaginative for you to swim without stopping every time you get in the pool anyway. Get some fins, swim underwater, go off the blocks and do a sprint, try one-arm fly. Be a wild thing - risk partial disregard for your lane mate.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:28:21 GMT

Barb...I think he acted a little selfish. If you can breaststroke a good "mis-kick" for each ankle grab seems a fair trade :rofl: Ok, it did occur to me after a couple hundred yards, that if I stopped dead in the water when he grabbed my ankle and make him swim over half of me, I could restart my flutter kick at a really inconvenient time for him. Just kidding!!

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:20:16 GMT

I prefer it because it is less time spent side by side, which means I am less likely to whack you. I also like having the whole wall for my turns. To some people that is more important than being passed (though I agree he should have just gone around). So way to be a bully and insist that your wholly irrational preference trumps someone else's wholly irrational preference. Bully? Nah. Just being reasonable as opposed to irrational.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:18:44 GMT

I shouldn't pick on the muppet. I was more directing my soap box speech towards the lane hoggers, most of whom will never swim Masters, or own anything other than baggy trunks. Hey I used to wear baggy shorts...:( Well, he did succeed in getting me into another lane. As soon as the aerobicizers were out, I was in. Unfortunately, I was pretty worn out by then and didn't get much accomplished. Barb...I think he acted a little selfish. If you can breaststroke a good "mis-kick" for each ankle grab seems a fair trade :rofl: We all hop into the empty lane when it's there...it's better for all...especially those flyers and the divine breaststrokers among us. I am grateful to all who I swim with at my Y that they are gracious and encouraging and helpful. Even if the odd rec swimmer gets in my way now and then I know they don't intend it and I can usally work around them until they're done. I was a rec swimmer too 3 months ago.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:12:58 GMT

I know what etiquette should be but he should have gone side by side. His right or not, social etiquette would also include being accomadative where possible--it overules pool etiqutte IMHO. I think he was trying to passively "bully" you into another lane so he could be on his own. Was everyone else in the appropriate lane for their speed and ability? Next time say "OK if you insist on circle but don't be touching my legs I find it offensive..." If he remonstrates let him know side by side will remedy the situation. If he tries to point you into a slower lane. Politely ask him if he feels it neccessary to make you share a lane with 2 other so he can swim alone. if he replies yes then tell him to get the guard to sort out all the lanes into appropriate speeds. Well, he did succeed in getting me into another lane. As soon as the aerobicizers were out, I was in. Unfortunately, I was pretty worn out by then and didn't get much accomplished. I'm trying not be be all "sour grapes" about this. I feel we both could have had a nice, unfrustrating swim if he had been more accomodating. Who knows, maybe he did want a lane to himself (don't we all?) and was purposely pushing the novice around. Or, maybe he was so wrapped up in what he was doing that he didn't notice or care how I was being impacted. Maybe he's just a Class A Jerk? I will handle the situation better next time. As I tell my daughter all the time, we can't make choices for other people, we can just make choices for ourselves. (Rolling eyes like she does, out the door...)

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:10:23 GMT

no, you shouldn't have had to stop if there was only two people in your lane. just swim like normal and let him pass you on your left. There is no that he can't do that.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 17:04:15 GMT

There is nothing that quite annoys me more than this selfish attitude. I don't care what you are doing, you don't hog your lane cause you are doing some interval work or causing a lot of splash. Share the dang pool. When I can't find my own lane and have to share the first thing I look for is some blowhard who thinks he/she owns the lane and I jump right in with them. Most people who come into a pool will first look for the empty lane. If you know there aren't empty lanes, you should go to one side of the lane you are in and leave room for other swimmers, regardless of their ability. As to this situation, some swimmers, especially those who swam competitively for a long time, seem to prefer circle swimming. I have to constantly remind my daughter to not circle swim in meets. It could just be a habit and nothing insidious, although it is more fun to speculate about sinister motives! Geek I think Muppet got a little confused as to who was there first, and thought the guy came after and acted unreasonably. I think his response was a bit light hearted though. Just trying to prevent a scrap.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:59:58 GMT

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:46:09 GMT

Thanks for your perspective. This fellow was in the lane first and didn't discouraging from sharing. He insisted on circle swimming, which from what all of you say, is certainly his right. I've circle swam before, but usually with someone whom I'm fairly pace-matched with. This fellow wasn't a quasi-noodler, but a fast and solid swimmer. If he had passed me like Warren was suggesting, I wouldn't have had any problems, but I kept getting my ankle grabbed so I moved aside at turns for him. I'm not upset at him (now, at least ;)), but was more upset that I didn't know how to handle or resolve the situation. I've read plently here from elite swimmers frustrated with novices who don't know the rules of the road, so I've tried hard to be considerate. Perhaps I won't be so meek (not usually a term applied to me) the next time it's just not working out. I know what etiquette should be but he should have gone side by side. His right or not, social etiquette would also include being accomadative where possible--it overules pool etiqutte IMHO. I think he was trying to passively "bully" you into another lane so he could be on his own. Was everyone else in the appropriate lane for their speed and ability? Next time say "OK if you insist on circle but don't be touching my legs I find it offensive..." If he remonstrates let him know side by side will remedy the situation. If he tries to point you into a slower lane. Politely ask him if he feels it neccessary to make you share a lane with 2 other so he can swim alone. if he replies yes then tell him to get the guard to sort out all the lanes into appropriate speeds.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:34:08 GMT

To further discourage lanemates, warn them you are doing an interval workout that may include some fly. The massive splashage and wakeage could help to move a quasi-noodler to another lane. Thanks for your perspective. This fellow was in the lane first and didn't discouraging from sharing. He insisted on circle swimming, which from what all of you say, is certainly his right. I've circle swam before, but usually with someone whom I'm fairly pace-matched with. This fellow wasn't a quasi-noodler, but a fast and solid swimmer. If he had passed me like Warren was suggesting, I wouldn't have had any problems, but I kept getting my ankle grabbed so I moved aside at turns for him. I'm not upset at him (now, at least ;)), but was more upset that I didn't know how to handle or resolve the situation. I've read plently here from elite swimmers frustrated with novices who don't know the rules of the road, so I've tried hard to be considerate. Perhaps I won't be so meek (not usually a term applied to me) the next time it's just not working out.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 16:21:20 GMT

Count your blessings he asked to swim with you - and hopefully he was gentleman enough to thank you when whichever one of you got out first got out. I agree with Professor Nelson - first person there has squatters rights over circles vs. splits, even though most pool rules specifically mention "CIRCLE SWIM ONLY!!!" When I am swimming during a rec swim and get a lanemate, I generally see them approaching during turns, etc., and will start taking a side and I finish whatever I am working on. When I stop and they ask to join, I welcome them to the lane, and tell them I will take *this side, and then push off at the closest :05/:10 on the clock to avoid any further interaction, such as you describe. If they don't like the arrangement, they're going to have to deal with it at least until my next interval is up. To further discourage lanemates, warn them you are doing an interval workout that may include some fly. The massive splashage and wakeage could help to move a quasi-noodler to another lane. Oooooooooooooooooh i'm gonna travel to DC, disguise myself as paddler and join the lane with the fuzzy haired guy. The do a really bad, not getting hair wet breaststroke down the cneter and then blame you when we collide... :rofl: ...did I mention that's what I got the other day. I virtually take toenails off on the lane line trying to stay out of the way, why do others not feel they need to? Obviously a bump here or there will happen...but lane hogging...GRRR.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:49:33 GMT

Thanks to you both. One of the challenges of joining a new community is figuring out what the group norms are. I don't think it occurred to the fellow last night that he could flip on a turn signal and pass me mid-lane. I didn't think of it either.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

some_girl — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:15:14 GMT

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

knelson — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:12:14 GMT

I've actually found the worst situation is to have someone slightly slower than you (or slightly faster). Say one or the other is lapping the other guy every few hundred yards. Your speeds are close enough that it will be fairly difficult to pass other than if someone stops at the wall. If one person is way faster than the other passing is easy and shouldn't really mess up either the slow or the fast swimmer.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

aquageek — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:12:06 GMT

I shouldn't pick on the muppet. I was more directing my soap box speech towards the lane hoggers, most of whom will never swim Masters, or own anything other than baggy trunks.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

The Fortress — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 12:11:04 GMT

I made a few people downright irate by refusing to circle swim when there was only two people in a lane. What is the point? Three or more I would have no problem but some people feel the need to circle swim all the time, like it somehow justifies their existence. I likewise refuse to circle swim when I'm swimming alone in my rec pool and there's 2 people per lane. There is no point. That way, if you are different speeds, you swim unimpeded. In my experience, people seem pretty content with splitting the lane. I have no problem sharing a lane with a slower swimmer. No one should have to wait for a lane. And I'm happy to dodge them on fly. But I don't want to circle swim with them. If I were you, Barb, I would be pissed at having my ankle repeatedly grabbed. Besides, circle swimming just reinforces circle swimming. Don't want to be circle swimming in meets. (Just watched my daughter do this big time her last 200 free.) Nice to have a chance to swim straight when you're not practicing with the team. Don't worry, Barb, Muppet won't think it's a "scrap." More likely to laugh and give a :dedhorse: .

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

aquageek — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 11:56:57 GMT

To further discourage lanemates, warn them you are doing an interval workout that may include some fly. The massive splashage and wakeage could help to move a quasi-noodler to another lane. There is nothing that quite annoys me more than this selfish attitude. I don't care what you are doing, you don't hog your lane cause you are doing some interval work or causing a lot of splash. Share the dang pool. When I can't find my own lane and have to share the first thing I look for is some blowhard who thinks he/she owns the lane and I jump right in with them. Most people who come into a pool will first look for the empty lane. If you know there aren't empty lanes, you should go to one side of the lane you are in and leave room for other swimmers, regardless of their ability. As to this situation, some swimmers, especially those who swam competitively for a long time, seem to prefer circle swimming. I have to constantly remind my daughter to not circle swim in meets. It could just be a habit and nothing insidious, although it is more fun to speculate about sinister motives!

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Muppet — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:54:27 GMT

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

knelson — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 10:23:19 GMT

I agree with Kevin. The second person entering the lane should ask the first person whether they'd like to split the lane or circle swim. If he wants to circle it's not going to bother him (or shouldn't) that he's got to pass you regularly. You shouldn't alter your workout to try to avoid him. Just swim how you normally would and let him do his thing.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:51:39 GMT

Geek, if you would loudly proclaim "I am the AquaGeek- fear me!", before you enter the water, I am sure you would always have an empty lane.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:49:07 GMT

The club I once swam with in North Vancouver was great, but since we were actually part of the city's recreation program anybody could join in and were hard to turf out for bad behavior. There was this one triathlete who started swimming in our second fastest lane, always wore huge paddles and more often than not swam over people trying to do stroke sets etc. Until I spotted him swimming over my future wife who was doing breastroke at the time (we had commenced dating). Flames shot out of my nostrils as I donned my paddles, ducked under the ropes, and 'passed' him several times in the same manner. Never saw him again, but future wife was briefly angry as she had planned to launch him with a well-placed breastroke kick.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:39:38 GMT

I started this thread to find out what the "norms" are for swimming 2 or 2+ per lane, not to vilify the my lanemate. I wanted to find out how to handle this situation, and through all your replies, I have some ideas on what's ok to do and what's not and what's a coin toss. In hindsight, I could have done a couple of things differently. For one, even though he was in the slow lane, I saw that he was a fast swimmer, so when he requested that we circle, I should have.... If he was swimming fast in the slow lane and tapping your feet every 75 yards, you can point out to him that he is in the slow lane. If he does not move and continues to be a jerk, you have every right to get the lifeguard to move him out of the slow lane. Lifeguards are supposed to monitor that kind of stuff so tensions don't escalate during what is meant to be leisure time. These kinds of things are why I advocate organized masters programs and think one should avoid open rec swim at all costs. There are still tiffs that happen at masters, but nothing like open rec swim. It's worse than the LA freeway.

RE: Clarifying Lane Etiquette

Former Member — Thu, 18 Jan 2007 09:16:08 GMT

I think after having my ankle grabbed more than once, I would have had to return the favor as he passed..... but would have had to hold on firmly for, ...Oh, ....a good 1/2 length or so (veritably skiing behind him, or acting as the lead weight anchor)...:joker: