michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Thu, 29 Jul 2004 09:30:10 GMT

I have not actually seen the NBC coverage, but having lived in Canada and watched their coverage of some major sporting events, I have a good idea of what it was like. I would probably have been irritated by it as well. TV coverage could change to show more of the artistry and skill that swimmers have. Swimming has a major advantage over other sports because of the beautiful fluid dynamics effects that could be shown to the public. This is really under utilised at present. I would like to see some more shots that show the beauty of swimming. The shots that show surface tension and water deforming around bodies and trailing vortices filmed in super slow motion are very dramatic and could promote the sport well. Very little of this is seen in normal coverage of a fast 100m event. If however live feeds were delayed to allow periods of super slow footage in an event it could enhance the coverage. The underwater shots at Sydney worked well, different camera angles can also add to the excitement. Could sensors be added to swimsuits that would display information such as velocity, water pressure, drag etc ? If it could be done this info could be displayed during a race or analysed afterwards.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 28 Jul 2004 10:03:03 GMT

Well, Guvnah- if blood they want, then blood they'll get! Announcing the new swimming-archery event...watch world records fall in the water as the unlucky also-swams are ministered to by medical personnel...

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 28 Jul 2004 09:32:21 GMT

Face it. Not many people get excited about swiming. There's no blood. No contact. And, frankly, very few fans relative to the population base as a whole. If you want more people tuning to watch swimming, there should be some events done in the nude. :) :)

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 28 Jul 2004 07:27:09 GMT

Hey Matt, good to see you back. Dreamin' is fine as long as you eventually come back to reality. What sports-coverage model, currently working (ie profitable enough to be self-sustaining) in the US, would you like to see appplied to swimming throughout the year? Or are you thinking "whole new (for the US) paradigm"? If so, what entity(ies) are likely to undertake such a risk? Will it be an existing swim-interested entity or will it be an entity that already has a track record developing new marketing strategies for sports? Down Under, did TV create a whole new market for swimming coverage or did TV build on an existing wide base of interest for the sport? If swimming were already a "major" spectator sport here in the US, hope for more coverage done "our way" might not be in vain. As it is, however, every bit of free coverage we DO get is better than nothing at all, which is what we get MOST of the time. If we were actually PAYING for the coverage we're getting I could see complaining about it. But we're not, so we shouldn't. I wonder how many of the most avid swimming spectators (that would be US) communicated thanks and encouragement to NBC for bringing us the coverage that they did? Here's my dream - NBC receives 40,000 snail-mail, individually written, "Thank you" notes from USMS members after the Trials coverage - all asking for EVEN MORE underwater footage of the swimming events during the Olympics. Now I gotta get back to reality and take my kids to the archery range (where the fervent hope among the avid participants is that there will be more than one 30 second blip of archery coverage during the olympics). Did you know there are more avid archers in the US than avid swimmers? Most are bowhunters so NBC will probably have Ted Nugent as the color announcer when they finally give archery its "due" coverage.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 27 Jul 2004 15:45:08 GMT

Emmett, I completely understand your point about NBC's coverage, and I think it is valid. Clearly, we in the swimming world would like to see our favorite sport get more exposure, credit, money for the pros, etc. Moreover, we are, or we should be, OK with seeing it morph into a bit more of a spectator friendly spectacle, and not be such purists about covering a meet just the way we want it. I agree this is a trend in the direction where we want to go. However, you can overdo it. Everyone would like to take college courses where the instructors are lively, interesting and humorous where appropriate, but there comes a point when a lecture ceases to be an educational presentation and turns into a stand-up routine. Everyone would like a little jazzy, more engaging music in their worship service, but there comes a point where it ceases to be a worship service and turns into a Vegas floor show. We would all like swimming to be more popular, but I hope we stop short of the WWF or NBA big money, freak show. If we were to look for a model of what we'd like, I would recommend the way swimming is covered as a major sport in Australia. Maybe I'm dreamin', and we Americans are culturally prone to turn our major sports into cynical, money-grubbing, self-promotion-above-all-else cess-pools, but hey, a guy can dream, can't he? Matt

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Thu, 22 Jul 2004 11:53:50 GMT

Good point. We've seen an explosion in pay per view offerings in the last few years as cable and satellite companies try to make extra money. Directv has a package for English football that's pretty pricey, but people are paying almost $200 to see Manchester United and Arsenal. Then there's the OLN coverage of the Tour de France. Who would have ever thought that someone would cover that thing stage to stage? Part of it is Lance's quest for 6, of course, but if OLN does well, they may try again next year. If you like a network's coverage of your sport and want them to do more, write and say so, but more importantly write the advertisers and buy their products. If we want more and better coverage of our sport, we need to show NBC and it's advertisers that it's worth it for them financially. On another note-it will be interesting to watch our pools and see if the olympics motivates anyone to jump on in with us!

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 16:37:08 GMT

NBC has taken a lot of flak for the time they spend on personal stories instead of showing events-from people like us who are interested in seeing the events themselves. Most people who watch the Olympics are not runners or swimmers themselves, so the personal stories give them a connection that keeps them interested. Without NBC and their affiliate media constantly driving home the 7 gold thing, nobody outside the swimming community would know who Michael Phelps was-not to mention the other amazing members of USA swimming. NBC needs to engage the non-athletes in order to get the number of viewers that advertisers want. It's all about the money.....

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 16:25:24 GMT

You are so right Frank about NBC not showing enough actual EVENTS!! What really infuriated me was that they didn't show Monday's events live. A local (Ryan Lochte) was swimming in the 200 IM, and I would have loved to see it live. However, NBC had something much more important to air - Fear Factor, the show where they eat bugs and stuff. So I had to be content with "watching" the 200 IM on-line via the Omega timing hook-up.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 14:56:35 GMT

NBC is absolutely NOT in the business of trying to provide coverage for the very tiny group of viewers that REALLY CARES about the competition minutiae of the different Olympic events and seeing every last second of every competition. And we should hope they never GET into that business. Why? Cuz they'd be OUT of business in a hurry and there would be NO coverage. We are not a big enough market to interest the kind of advert $$ needed to support such a coverage effort. Failing to provide a healthy dose of human interest and failure to edit with an eye toward providing good competitive drama without big nap gaps would simply drive off the audience that really pays the bills. Think of it a different way - how much would you be willing to pay-per-view for precisely the "afficianado" coverage we'd really like to see? I wouldn't be surprised if such an offering would cost WAY more than watching PPV football or boxing (by an order of magnitude?). How many people in the US would be willing to pay such a price? Seems to me that what you get right now for FREE represents a far greater value than what you'd get with a PPV that only had 500K viewers (and I think THAT would be a very optimistic number of PPViewers - mebbe more like 100K). So, yes it IS all about the money - thankfully.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Frank Thompson — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 12:01:37 GMT

I thought NBC's coverage of the Olympic Trials was not as good as previous Olypmpic trials of the past. They showed 15 completed swimming events with highlights in the other events. Comparing this with the 2000 trails they showed 23 completed swimming events. They showed 22 in 1996 and 20 each in 1988 and 1992. Those other Olympic Trials were not live feeds but were 4 hours tape delayed. The biggest dissapointment was not seeing Michael Phelps swim the World Record in the 400 IM at the start of the competition. Instead we see wasted time on his SUV, what he eats for breakfast, interviews after every race about his medal expectations by the press, walking on the deck throwing his silver medal to female fans in the stands, and having his picture taken with Cindy Crawford. That kind of stuff I can see on ET. Then with a half hour left in the telecast they show one event the women's 50 Free. Then we hear from Bob Bowman and Ed Reese about Michael Phelps quest for 7 golds and what relays he may swim and how the relays will be determined. Again wasted time. Then we see Rowdy Gaines and Dan Hicks with the telestrater like John Madden does in Football diagraming the strategy for 7 golds that we have already heard about so many times. Then we see the VISA commerical that talks about the 7 golds so that message just keeps pounding in our heads. Again wasted time on something we already know. Instead of hearing Bob Bowman and Eddie Reese I want to see there swimmers swim the races. Another dissapointment was not seeing Brenden Hansen's World Record in the 100 ***. I want to see the race not the highlights. Being the 1st American to go under a minute and the second person to do it would have been great to see. How about seeing Katie Hoff in the 200 IM. One of Bob Bowman stars and a lot like Michael was in 2000. Had a great race with Amada Beard and would be nice to see Beard swim the IM since we only see heer swim breastroke. Also lets take a break on talking about Harold the teddy bear. Show some of the American Records races like Keller's 400 Free and Jason Lezek's 100 Free in the semi finals. This was the most successful Olympic Trials as far as records and we did not see a lot of them. Also I noticed they showed a lot of the same highlights repeatedly when they could have shown more races. There were two event finals shown during the Track&Field Olympic Trials ( M 200 Fly W 100 Free) but who is going to know about those unless you happen to tune in. Also how does Track&Field get 3 times the coverage that swimming has? I noticed that when I watched the T&F trials they showed a lot more of the races and had a lot less personal stories. With all the hype that Michael Phelps had I thought he swam one of greatest trials ever. To swim 17 events and swim as well as he did was something that I have never seen. I don't know of any swimmer that has ever done that many events and put up the places and times that he did.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 10:37:15 GMT

Originally posted by Fitswimmer04 NBC has taken a lot of flak for the time they spend on personal stories instead of showing events-from people like us who are interested in seeing the events themselves. Most people who watch the Olympics are not runners or swimmers themselves, so the personal stories give them a connection that keeps them interested. Without NBC and their affiliate media constantly driving home the 7 gold thing, nobody outside the swimming community would know who Michael Phelps was-not to mention the other amazing members of USA swimming. NBC needs to engage the non-athletes in order to get the number of viewers that advertisers want. It's all about the money..... I've complained about NBC's soap opera-like coverage in the past, but in fairness to NBC, getting viewers interested in the personalities doesn't only get them to watch their coverage, it may also get them interested in OUR sport. :)

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Wed, 21 Jul 2004 08:23:25 GMT

I think that NBC should be given kudos for improving coverage of the 2004 OT trials. Isn't this the first time that the trials were covered LIVE? Can't judge the quality of the live coverage since I attended the Trials but the taped coverage the following weekend did seem like an improvement. Also the comment about taped coverage during Track and Field Trials was well publized both in CA and NE so no complaint there and I'm not under the impression that Track received more coverage than Swimming. And isn't NBC doing a great job with those commercials that feature Phelps, Coughlin, et.al? Furthermore they promised 70 hours of DAILY coverage once the Olympics start and, while the TV coverage for the Olympics is supposed to be posted at the end of this week, I've been told that we can expect to pick-up live coverage on NBC affiliated cable during the Olympics. While for me, having every race TIVO'd would the ultimate coverage let's give NBC some credit for doing a better job covering the Trials this year. Now let's see how much of the Olympic swiming will be in HDTV.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 14:04:34 GMT

Again, I HOPE I AM WRONG because Michael Phelps is one of life’s good guys and I would love to see him win 7 Gold Medals in Athens….BUT, it is so far off the planet tough these days to accomplish a feat such as this in swimming…. that is akin to….Whizzing in the Ocean to raise the tide……Not going to happen….

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 12:33:25 GMT

Originally posted by Sam Perry So who here thinks Natalie could have had a very legitimate shot at the 7 golds? I for one think she would have had a better shot than Michael had she decided to swim these events: 100 Fly 200 Back 100 Free 200 Free All three relays Not me, and more to the point she would have been less likely than Phelps for the following reasons: 1) The key to winning multiple medals at the Olympics is to train and race at big time international meets with a program that emulates the Olympic program. That was the lesson that Spitz took from 1968 and Bowman/Phelps used 2003 Worlds as their Olympic laboratory. Coughlin did not have a similar opportunity at Worlds so she did have the confidence/experience to try it in Athens. Also her performance at Trials suggests she does not have the physical/mental make-up for multiple INDIVIDUAL medal attempts. NB: NCAA does not count since it is short course a very different sport than long course. 2) The supposed "relay" advantage of the US women is not real. Both US men/women medley relays are odds on favorite. However, this year's US women's team is relatively weak (compared to 2000) on paper and the US women cannot be considered odds-on favorites in the 400/800 free relay.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 08:57:52 GMT

I want everyone here to know I am a very positive guy...MOST of the time....Having said that.....I just cannot see 7 Gold Medals around ONE swimmers neck in the same Olympics happening as things stand in swimming today. I seriously admire Michael Phelps and HOPE like heck he proves me dead wrong....and...I will eat public crow if he proves me wrong....but I do not think it is going to happen....

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 06:49:41 GMT

Originally posted by Tom Ellison Of coarse it is a worthy pursuit because it brings wanted publicity to swimming as a sport. My tone has nothing to do with that fact….I simply wanted to express my thoughts on how improbable it really is. As to your thoughts on Biondi....I 1 Zillion % agree with you, Biondi is ANYTHING but a failure….Heck, the guy is a swimming ICON and anyone who refers to Matt Biondi as a failure is either a moron or knows absolutely NOTHING about swimming! I believe anyone who even gets to the big show (Olympics) is a serious winner in my book….A lowly swimmer like me couldn’t carry 99% of our Olympic Swimmers goggles…. Hey, not just olympians. Anyone who is up at the crack of dawn to swim thousands of yards several times a week (or more) has a very big chunk of winner in them. Contrats to all of you!:cool:

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 06:40:00 GMT

Of coarse it is a worthy pursuit because it brings wanted publicity to swimming as a sport. My tone has nothing to do with that fact….I simply wanted to express my thoughts on how improbable it really is. As to your thoughts on Biondi....I 1 Zillion % agree with you, Biondi is ANYTHING but a failure….Heck, the guy is a swimming ICON and anyone who refers to Matt Biondi as a failure is either a moron or knows absolutely NOTHING about swimming! I believe anyone who even gets to the big show (Olympics) is a serious winner in my book….A lowly swimmer like me couldn’t carry 99% of our Olympic Swimmers goggles….

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 06:24:07 GMT

Originally posted by Tom Ellison Spitz did it “once” but that was “then”….and a whole lot has changed since “then”…. NOT in today’s times.........Not going to happen…..Now, doing that is as close to an exercise in futility as it gets.....and again..I HOPE I AM WRONG.... I disagree with your tone. He has a shot, however improbable. And it's a worthy pursuit because it brings wanted publicity to swimming as a sport. I also diagree with Evans and others who claim that if he fails to get 7 golds he'll be painted a "failure" ala Biondi. First , Phelps get's to start off with the 400 im certain gold and a likely world record rather than the immediate disappointment of Biondi's first race. Second, I'm sure that the Olympic commentators will prepare the US public for Phelps likely loss in the 200 free. In fact coming in predicted to win bronze Phelps will likely win silver and exceed expectations. The key will be whether Phelps, Keller and Lochte can step up in the 800 free relay to beat the Aussies. That will provide more than enough "exceed expectations" to keep the Phelps medal watch train on track even if he eventually loses to Crocker in the 100 fly.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 06:06:37 GMT

Spitz did it “once” but that was “then”….and a whole lot has changed since “then”…. NOT in today’s times.........Not going to happen…..Now, doing that is as close to an exercise in futility as it gets.....and again..I HOPE I AM WRONG....

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 05:48:12 GMT

Originally posted by LindsayNB It seems a shame that someone like Phelps will not do as well as he might due to the schedule. Have Phelps and Crocker ever raced the 100 butterfly when Phelps was well rested? Looking at the trials, I wonder if it wouldn't be more interesting if swimmers could choose to use their time from preliminaries to qualify for the finals instead of swimming in the semi-finals. You would get some swimmers doing fast times in the prelims and arriving at the finals better rested. The prelims and semis would be more interesting and the finals faster. A. I would say that Crocker beat Phelps at World's under circumstances where Phelps was "relatively rested" given his multi-event schedule (remember the 400 im was at the end of that meet). B. The semi-finals does work to the advantage of some swimmers in that you can finish 16th in the prelim and still make it to the next round. BTW, for what it's worth I think that Phelps will beat Crocker in Athens, even though I'm pulling for Crocker since we need a 50 meter pool in Maine. That gives him four individual gold medals and means that his Spitzian fate is in the hands of his US teammates (who says swimming isn't a team sport?). I agree it's not highly probable but would disagree that it is so impossible as suggested by Tom Ellison. As Phelps so aptly replied to similar Ellison like prouncement "it's not impossible because Spitz did it once"

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 05:38:38 GMT

It seems a shame that someone like Phelps will not do as well as he might due to the schedule. Have Phelps and Crocker raced the 100 butterfly recently when Phelps was well rested? Looking at the trials, I wonder if it wouldn't be more interesting if swimmers could choose to use their time from preliminaries to qualify for the finals instead of swimming in the semi-finals. You would get some swimmers doing fast times in the prelims and arriving at the finals better rested. The prelims and semis would be more interesting and the finals faster.

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 05:35:58 GMT

I could have used a crude term but felt decency would be better served by reading between the lines.....Plus, Mr. Moose is the watch dog around here for decency and he insisted on that term.... That tide is never going to rise....trust me...!

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

Former Member — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 05:31:49 GMT

Originally posted by Tom Ellison Again, I HOPE I AM WRONG because Michael Phelps is one of life’s good guys and I would love to see him win 7 Gold Medals in Athens….BUT, it is so far off the planet tough these days to accomplish a feat such as this in swimming…. that is akin to….Whizzing in the Ocean to raise the tide……Not going to happen…. Hmmmmm..... is that one of those techincal swimming terms that I am not familiar with ...... whizzing?:p

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

knelson — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 03:54:43 GMT

Hey, no one thought Joe DiMaggio's 56 game hitting streak would ever be broken either. ....oops, never mind :D

RE: michael phelps--how many thing he will do it?

mattson — Tue, 20 Jul 2004 03:40:49 GMT

Originally posted by Tom Ellison Heck, the guy is a swimming ICON and anyone who refers to Matt Biondi as a failure is either a moron or knows absolutely NOTHING about swimming! Careful Tom, you don't want to get the whole flash-in-a-pan discussion restarted. ;)