Shock Of A Lifetime

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:52:08 GMT

Back when I swam High School we used to watch and see if someone false started, once they did, we would try and draw them off by using our one false start and get them DQ'd. It actually used to be used as a strategy to eliminate competition. Fair? No! Did it work? Yep! Did make for rather long meets sometimes!;)

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Mon, 29 Mar 2004 16:45:44 GMT

http:/.../1080544421751.html was trying to link to Thorpe article-go to goggle sports for good coverage

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:37:16 GMT

Hacket is going to be very tough to beat in the mile.....very tough...

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Mon, 29 Mar 2004 15:27:09 GMT

Pretty amazing and ranks right up near the top in terms of bone-headed moves...to get DQ'd in the PRELIMS of the OT!! I've seen guys false start during the 1500 or 1000 swim the entire race and then learn that they were out (most recently Eric Vendt at Spring Nationals) but not at Olympic Trials. I did see some relays get DQ'd in college championships when everyone jumped into the water to celebrate before the lagging teams finished their race. Thorpe's obviously "recovered' and will no doubt qualify in the other events. Re the 1500...I don't think you can enter an event "during the meet" then again some swimmers will enter every event they qualify in just to keep their competitors off guard and keep their options open. Bowman has already indicated that Phelps will be "entered" in every event where he has a qualifying time. Hopefully, Thorpe has similar forethought...then again I have my doubts based on his behavior earlier at the Trials. Too bad because I'd love to see Hackett beat him at the Olympics.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:34:57 GMT

I saw this on NBC I think. He didn't even come close to DQing in the normal sense. He fell off the blocks when he went to take his start. He actually "egg rolled" off the blocks. To me, though I don't make the rules, he fell and wasn't close to starting. This is going to make for an interesting Olympics.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sun, 28 Mar 2004 07:12:43 GMT

"Falling" off the blocks often happened before the no false start rule was adopted -- not as much since. That's the way swimmers would try to break the other competitors' concentration. So I think the rule makers actually had that in mind -- the rule doesn't specify that the false start be close to the actual start.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 17:20:45 GMT

www.smh.com.au/.../1079939853908.html An article by Kieran Perkins about how strict Australia's qualifying standards are and how even he (the world record holder at the time) wasn't selected for the team. I would safely say that Thorpe is out...

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 17:17:11 GMT

Originally posted by lefty Thorpe will be swimming the 400 at the Olympics. There is no question about it. Somehow they will find away. Perhaps the 2nd place finisher will elect to pullout of the event at the Olympics. In 2000 Grace Kim pulled out of the Olympics (tae-kwon-do) so that her training partner who she knew was better - could participate. I think that the second place finisher has every right to swim, but I really really don't think that will happen. If Australia follows the same selection rules as the U.S. -- which they seem to -- that couldn't happen. If the second place finisher dropped out, the third place finisher would move up (and then the fourth and so on). A disqualified swimmer wouldn't be in the "line of succession." As far as the "no false start" rule itself is concerned -- I started swimming when one false start was allowed. What happened then (which I think was the reason the no false start rule was adopted) was that swimmers were false starting intentionally to psyche out the competition. Not only did this break the concentration of the swimmers who didn't false start, it seriously delayed meets.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 17:12:55 GMT

This is disappointing. Can someone explain why you get DQ on your first false start. I always thought this was unfair. In track doesn't the whole field get charged with the first false start and then if someone false started after that you get DQ? Why can't this be used in swimming? It would be a shame for on of the world's greatest swimmers not to be able to swim in one of his best events. We should be allowed some room for mistakes.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:17:41 GMT

On a related note, Hackett swam really really fast in finals, 3:43.35 I am pretty sure that only THorpe has been faster than that.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 15:15:47 GMT

Thorpe will be swimming the 400 at the Olympics. There is no question about it. Somehow they will find away. Perhaps the 2nd place finisher will elect to pullout of the event at the Olympics. In 2000 Grace Kim pulled out of the Olympics (tae-kwon-do) so that her training partner who she knew was better - could participate. I think that the second place finisher has every right to swim, but I really really don't think that will happen. I guess there is a possibility that thrope will swim a different event - the 1500? - which would be kind of cool.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

mattson — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 10:21:49 GMT

I have a question, as someone who has not seen the incident and am not a referee. How much judgement does the referee have? If someone steps up, immediately stumbles into the water (before "take your mark" could be said), would this person still be DQ'ed? If the starter says "stand up", you hold it for some time but do eventually fall off balance, is that also a DQ? (My solution is to do a slow track start. ;) )

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 09:16:45 GMT

I was so shocked at first. But having seen many reports about it, read everything there is to read, listened to many people I think the referee made the right decision. Its always tough to disqualify the best swimmer, but just with with Kristine Quance in 1996, the referee did the right thing. This sport is incredibly fair compared to subjective ones (synchro, diving, figure skating etc etc) and he appears to have violated a rule... I must congratulate the deck officials for doing what they thought was right and the meet jury for seriously considering the protest.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 07:45:36 GMT

Originally posted by SWinkleblech This is disappointing. Can someone explain why you get DQ on your first false start. I always thought this was unfair. In track doesn't the whole field get charged with the first false start and then if someone false started after that you get DQ? Why can't this be used in swimming? It would be a shame for on of the world's greatest swimmers not to be able to swim in one of his best events. We should be allowed some room for mistakes. It used to be this way. It was when I attended my first meet (as a spectator) many years ago. But I always thought it was a bit unfair. Imagine that we have 2 swimmers, A and B, and that A false starts on the first try, and B false starts on the second. Under the old rules, B would be disqualified while A would not, even though each had false started once. Of course, you can say that B should have been extra careful the second time, since there had already been a false start. But then the question becomes: Why can't every swimmer be extra careful the first time? How would you feel if they had allowed 2 false starts in this heat, and Thorpe had lost his balance the second time (but not the first)? Bob

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

knelson — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:09:26 GMT

Originally posted by SWinkleblech We should be allowed some room for mistakes. I really don't think so. Not at this level. What, are you going to say a one handed touch in breaststroke is o.k. as long as you only do it once? The rules are the rules. Everyone know it's one false start and you're out.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

knelson — Sat, 27 Mar 2004 01:07:34 GMT

Originally posted by SWinkleblech This is disappointing. Can someone explain why you get DQ on your first false start. Back in the "old days" it was similar to track. I think they used to actually allow three false starts, where the first two were charged to the field. I think the main reason for changing the rule is people jumped just to get in the water. In events like the 50 there were all kinds of false starts and it really slowed down meets. But man this news is a real shocker. I don't see how the Aussies can do a thing about it. If he's DQed he's out. You can't just make an exception because he's Ian Thorpe. I've got to believe Thorpe himself realizes this.

RE: Shock Of A Lifetime

Former Member — Fri, 26 Mar 2004 15:11:49 GMT

A more complete account of the story has been posted on www.swiminfo.com.