news

RE: news

Former Member — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 15:39:42 GMT

Folks, There are a million reasons why we should welcome JC Fly to our discussion groups. But, I think another compelling reason pops out the minute you consider why he might chose to be a regular here. This is an excellent discussion forum. Look at some of the threads JC has started where he has asked for advice or comment, and look at the feed back he got. Ask Gareth why he posts and reads feedback here, rather than some of the swimming fora run out of his native UK. Most of all, take a look a the Football Player Turned Swimmer thread JoeyButts started, and the quality advice he received from a lot of experienced swimmers. As Jim Rhome would say, "have a take. Do not suck." That happens here consistently because the people who contribute make it happen. You cannot easily find this in an age group specific web site. It is particularly ironic that some suggest we need a swim forum for adults only, because this is one of the few I have seen where I would not be embarassed to have my children read what is being said. (I say this as one of the folks who have skated close to the edge of the collective standard of good taste, and pulled back by the other members.) Ask the administrators of the U.S. Swimming web sites about discussion threads that spun out of control and had to be shut down for abusive language. Here, threads get canned rarely, and usually for becoming tiresome rather than objectionable. Let's appreciate what we have and share it with the youngsters. Matt

RE: news

Former Member — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 14:56:14 GMT

I am in my 60s, and I am always gratified and encouraged by the support I receive from younger folks (almost everybody to me) - all the way down to 12 years old or so. In the water I am accepted as one of them, and their encouragement means a lot to me. Now the I have the opportunity to encourage a younger fellow, and I say, "Go get 'em!! I hope you achieve your goals". Here is something you might keep in mind. Rowdy Gaines, who won an Olympic gold medal, didn't begin competing until he was a junior in high school.

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Former Member — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 14:49:18 GMT

Originally posted by JC_FLY Physically, I think i'm up there with everybody else. I'm 6'2, 175lbs. I bench 190lbs, clean & jerk is at 110lbs, 40 yd dash is 4.8, and my 50 free is 25 seconds. I think the comment about the physical differences between you and an older swimmer didn't have as much to do with your strength or speed as the stage of development your muscles and other lean tissue are in. The simple fact is that, at your age, your muscles will react differently to training than mine at my age. Injuries won't affect you and me the same way either. But that's all the more reason for you to participate in the discussion here. I stopped swimming at age fourteen and didn't pick it up again until I was almost thirty. If I had understood then some of the things I know now about my body, I might have continued to train through high school and into college. By reading here and participating in the discussion, your vision of your athletic program will extend far beyond the next meet or next year's team. Listening to us talk about our aches and pains, our triumphs and defeats, you get a head start on all your teammates for training for your life instead of just the next ribbon. And as I said before, we benefit from your enthusiasm.

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Former Member — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 13:32:37 GMT

Hey JC, When you said, " . . . and to learn better technique and stuff like that, " you are on the right track. No one here will argue much that swimming is technique, technique, technique. Besides, there are many threads on this forum have discussed this in the past and will continue to do so in the future. If you find something that works better for you, let us know about it. What you might have learned might help someone else out, too. There's no doubt that you are "up there with everybody." Your school's pool sounds like a busy place, which is great. Swimming has taken a back seat in high schools in this area. You need not apologize for posting here. 99.44% of us here do realize that you "are the future," hence the support you have received. (It's the .66% who needs to live with it!) :D To quote a famous philosopher below (Tom Ellison) . . . "As to your swimming, you’re on the right track by setting goals for yourself. Keep focused on the long haul and always remember that what you put into the water today, will be akin to putting money in the bank for tomorrow. The deposit you put in the pool each day at practice is the check you get to cash in a meet in the future….GO for it kid…and give it your all!" And like I said before, Tom means very much what he says. Later.

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swimr4life — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 09:53:42 GMT

I don't post very often but this topic really touched my heart. I would like to point out that only one person posting on this thread was not happy about JC participating in our discussion forum! Most Masters Swimmers simply LOVE THIS SPORT and want to share their passion for swimming with anyone who will listen! (Note my user name!) JC we think it is awesome that you have the determination and intelligence to seek out advice on your swimming from us "older, experienced" swimmers! I have a 15 year old daughter that swims and she won't ask me for advice and gets mad if I give her any! If you need any advice, you can email me personally! I'm a swim coach and would love to help you in any way. Determination, hard work and love of swimming are three of the most important factors for success not only in High School/College swimming but for Masters swimming too! Keep us posted on your success! HAPPY SWIMMING! :D

RE: news

Former Member — Tue, 18 Nov 2003 06:30:27 GMT

Physically, I think i'm up there with everybody else. I'm 6'2, 175lbs. I bench 190lbs, clean & jerk is at 110lbs, 40 yd dash is 4.8, and my 50 free is 25 seconds. we had our first practice today(11-17-03) and I am only 1 of the 2 divers on the team, and I am one of the top 4 swimmers on the team. there is this kid who swims a 50 at about 23 seconds, then myself, and then we have 2 others around 28. we have a fairly large team. ESPECIALLY for a washington school. about 20 team members, then we share the pool with 2 other teams, they have 10, and 2. so we have 32 people swimming in the pool at the same time. which is fine with me, because the faster swimmers swim in lane 6(thats where I am) and then we have the the beginners and slower people in lane 1&2. the intermediate at lane 3, and we use lanes 4&5 for diving, and lane 6 is where the expierienced swimmers are. practice is from 3-5 pm. and diving practice is from 3-4:30pm. but diving is only like every other day or somewhere around that. I think we might have an ok season this year, but if not, it's ok with me. I am just using this year to get back in shape, and to learn better technique and stuff like that. so that is just an update on me. by the way, I am aware that I am younger than most of the posters here, but I say, live with it, I am the future(my generation) and I'm just trying to learn as much as I can from experienced swimmers like yourselves.

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 17:12:06 GMT

We discuss this before. There was a small college we have recently an ex-football player swim on the team. So, you would have to look at different college programs in your area. Masters would love to have either male or female in the 19 to 24 year old groups. Because of many college progams, there are few that swim in that age group, but if you do college you can do masters in summer time if your not in a state that has a water polo program at the college level. As for relately, most of the meets I did were 30 years ago in age group swimming, so I can still relate to teenage swimming. Its just that my times as a teenager are even more medocre now than back then.

RE: news

Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 17:10:04 GMT

Originally posted by laineybug "Hold on to sixteen as long as you can..." LOL, now if I can only remember who sang that! John Mellencamp (back when he was called John Cougar). The song is Jack and Diane. The rest of that line is: Hold on to sixteen as long as you can Changes come around real soon Make us women and men A classic.

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 16:46:22 GMT

Jessie's girl is right! The recent "Day Job" and "Transport" threads really had nothing to do with swimming but no one cared and we had fun with them... but let a sincere kid post something off topic and he gets jumped on?

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 16:20:35 GMT

Well, actually physically there is not much different between 16 years old up to around 40 years old if you kept track of the masters times. I'm similar to myself at 12 years old or 13 years olds. I'm 46 years old and probably handle the yardage of an 11-12 year old novice swimmer. Actually in terms of strength a 25 year old male and a 40 year old male are more similar than a 16 year old. Most males develop their strength in their 20's and a 16 year old is more similar to a 45 year old man. when it comes to physical strength.

RE: news

Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 14:22:37 GMT

By the way, JC_FLY, Tom's advice is excellent. Trust me on that. So don't be afraid to ask him questions. His knowledge is awesome. :cool: He has given a lot of advice and much-needed support to someone who shares his age ... me. :D So, as my good friend, Tom, says, visit with us anytime. (That means "don't be a stranger!")

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 14:07:31 GMT

Phil brought up a very good point. I'm 21 and if I tore my ACL I would be fine for surgery. My training style and health concerns are probably closer to a 16 year old then a 30, 40, 50+ year old but I am in the age of Masters swimming. So using all these reasons for the 16 year old not to post here is kinda crazy. I understand msgrupp's concern about having teenagers post here but until JC_Fly starts posting immature, off-topic, crude comments let him be. He was happy about turning 16 just like a recent "rite of passage" for me was turning 21. Is it really that big of a pain to skip over his thread? Not every thread that has been started here has been directly about swimming but the fact that we are all swimmers unites us. Until the boards start getting cluttered up with junk I say chill. Ok that's my $.02

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 14:03:08 GMT

Gosh, not many things shock me anymore, but posting that a young, impressionable swimmer in NOT WELCOME to post here…SHOCKS ME! Wow, step away here and look at what you have written…..If we, as US Masters Swimmers cannot welcome and tolerate the postings of our youth…who in all reality are the future of US Masters Swimming…. and….at the same time lead them, guide them, teach them, instruct them, motivate them and welcome them, then what have we become? Our children are the future of our sport and they are a blessing. Here is a kid that is proud of getting his drivers license and he finds time to post on OUR forum; as opposed to hanging around in some mall or getting into goodness knows what. Here is a kid that has set goals for his swimming and is proud to share these goals with us and we post that he is not welcome here due to his age. Shame on us if we cannot openly welcome this young swimmer onto our web page. Shame on us if we cannot find time to help guide him, motivate him, teach him, instruct him and more then anything else…listen to him. Hey kid, anytime you want to talk swimming or want my 53 year old guys ten cents worth of advice on any subject, simply write me an e-mail, I am ALWAYS willing and HONORED to take my time and share anything I know with a kid that wants to learn. As to your swimming, you’re on the right track by setting goals for yourself. Keep focused on the long haul and always remember that what you put into the water today, will be akin to putting money in the bank for tomorrow. The deposit you put in the pool each day at practice is the check you get to cash in a meet in the future….GO for it kid…and give it your all!

RE: news

Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 12:40:16 GMT

I do not think my children are ANGELS and that is why a good relationship with adults is such an important thing. If a teen can talk to an adult like JC and the young man at my pool, it is a good thing. Kids need good role models. If those models turn their back on them, who are they going to turn to? I too like the enthusiasm that JC gives us. Try being around teens more, even though they are struggling to grow up and find themselves in a tough world, they are fun and full of energy and most are going to be terrific people and our future leaders. This world is a hard enough place to be without shutting out kids like JC. And a note, getting a drivers liscense is a much harder process now then when I was young. There is a lot more driving time required than there used to be(which is a good thing). There are a lot of kids who cannot get their liscense at 16, simply because they have not had time to fill the requirements.

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Former Member — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 11:26:34 GMT

Personally, I have found many 16 year olds to have the maturity level, emotionally and physically, of those who are 18. And of course, many "adults" have a maturity level more appropriate for a 10 year old.

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aquageek — Mon, 17 Nov 2003 04:31:39 GMT

msgrupp: Thanks for being such a good amabassador for Masters swimming. I'm sure when JC becomes 19 he will surely want to join USMS, especially with your words of encouragement. JC - msgrupp is not indicative of USMS.

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 17:54:35 GMT

My daughter got her driver's license a year ago and it was nice having her drive herself to swim practice!!

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 16:08:22 GMT

I don't post often, but this hits a little close to home for me. Why should we discourage someone, who obviously shares a love for the sport as we do, from chiming in on this board, based solely on his age? Personally, I have found many 16 year olds to have the maturity level, emotionally and physically, of those who are 18. I applaud our teen poster for having the initiative to seek out this board and to post. For what it's worth, I've a daughter swimmer that age, who is helping me to learn to butterfly. Her swim buddies think it's pretty cool that someone "my age" is competing. Frankly, I think that ideas and enthusiasm from the young (almost) adults are a breath of fresh air, and swimming is an excellent vehicle to help bridge the generation gap(s). And as for this statement... "Look--I don't ask to swim on a competitive basis with the age-group swimmers in the jr high and high school AND they shouldn't ask to swim with the Masters groups." .....while it may be a humbling experience, I have found myself (as a member of USA Swimming) competing against teens many times, primarily because of a lack of opportunity to compete against my peers, and my desire to get some competition experience. Big deal! It made for some good fun and showed the kids that there is swimming beyond puberty without olympic expectations. The exchange between teens and adults is mutually beneficial, and not threatening or intrusive at all. We should exercise caution against treating youngsters harshly. Cheers!

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:23:02 GMT

I suspect that 16-year old JC_FLY has more in common, physically, to our 20+ year old members than some crotchety 50+ year old member has in common, physically, to our 20+ year old members. Or maybe these crotchety members are the reason we have so few 20+ members? We've spent a lot of time talking about why boys don't seem to swim so much any more. Maybe JC_FLY can contribute some real information to that recurring thread. Some of us, with teenage children, are interested in what teenagers have to say. We may not hear what we should from our own children! Anyway, I hope JC_FLY has the courage to stay here, after being told to leave by what I think and hope is a small minority.

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:20:54 GMT

A driver license is not a RIGHT of passage, it is a privaledge that is earned... I'm amazed that some folks don't remember what it feels like to earn it! Its been 36 years for me and I still remember! So what if it isn't on topic... he has asked questions related to swimming, and because we have treated him with respect in the past, he wanted to share his excitement with us. AGAIN, another great complement! "Hold on to sixteen as long as you can..." LOL, now if I can only remember who sang that! Lainey

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 15:10:14 GMT

Who Dey! Finally, aquageek and I share the same opion...I thought that would never happen! Don't know about all of you, but I'm shocked at the bitterness towards the 16 year old guy who is stoked about swimming and life in general. Frankly, I find it refreshing to have an interested younger visitor. Keep up the good work kiddo! Jerrycat ;)

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 14:41:23 GMT

msgrupp, you said "Not trying to have any assumptions--but if you're both parents-- I'm guessing you're the type that believes HIS/HER child is an angel and should be included in ANYTHING that you're doing--invited or not." You ARE making an assumption, and we know what happens when you do that. For the record, my two boys are pretty much normal kids - sometimes good and sometimes not so good. They are not included in everything that my wife and I do. I believe it's important for parents to have their adult time. I just don't see how JC posting on this site is a harm. msgrupp, you also said "By the way Scansy--short of putting some kind of block on JC-Fly--how do YOU propose I weed out what he is posting when he answers in another question? " His name appears to the left of his posts just like everyone elses. Just pass by his posts if you don't want to read them. Shaky, as for your post - well said.

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 14:20:12 GMT

Hey Shaky! WELL SAID! Regards, Mark

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 14:16:09 GMT

Two years isn't really a long time. I don't think it's unreasonable for someone to be thinking about what he might be doing in two years, even if he is 16 years old. If this kid has found this site, he may be thinking forward to the day that high school swimming is over, and how he's going to continue swimming afterwards. Having a timeline in his head that continues beyond the "end" of his high school swimming career and into college or masters swimming will likely help him train better now, and especially next year, when the excitement, pressures and distractions of being a high school senior might cause him to sluff off. For someone this close to the age at which he might join, is it reasonable to discourage his participation in the discussion and possibly discourage his interest in the organization itself? Furthermore, even if the problems of a 16 year old are different from those of a thirty-something, it's good to have a variety of viewpoints represented. It just might happen that you have a problem you don't know how to fix that you think is unique to your age group, and this kid hears something from his coach that can help you solve it. Or it may just be that his youthful enthusiasm infects one of us old farts enough that he decides to end that month long hiatus he took after work took him out of town, when the momentum of being out of the pool kept him out of the pool and he couldn't find the motivation to face the unruly crowd at the Y. To JC: Congrats on the time and the drivers license, kid. Try to hang on to this excitement as long as you can, and don't turn bitter when you are reading this board in a few years and see some other 16 year old posting when you think you have more important things to read about.

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Former Member — Sun, 16 Nov 2003 14:08:30 GMT

MSGRUPP: anything but isn't this board supposed to be for MASTERS swimmers? And isn't the definition of MASTERS swimmers limited to those over 18 (or is it 21). What happens when we, those in Masters Swimming, don't encourage those younger than 18? Simple. We will end up no younger Masters members, read "new Members." I agree with Scansy and Laineybug. No "Bah! Humbug" should be allowed here! JC, we are more than honored to have you ask for our opinions and anytime you have a questions . . . fire away! I am sure there will be a time we may ask you something, too. We are also very happy that you love swimming. Congrats on getting your driver's license and your birthday, too. I share your b'day also. In two more years, just remember to join us officially. Keep us informed of your progress, like everyone else does here. Who knows ... you might be another Michael Phelps. :D Kindest regards. Go get 'em.