underwater face-up with breath control

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Mon, 17 Jun 2019 07:26:02 GMT

I felt the need to at least post the real key of this technique, because I think it is important to explain something to those who have difficulties with this. There may be no one interested in this technique on this forum, but a forum is for information to anyone who comes here Yes, thank you. People come to forums searching for info they need, and may find a post 10+ years prior that is helpful to them. I have the same issue stated in your op, am now trying to understand this latest post by you :)

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Sat, 15 Jun 2019 09:31:22 GMT

Stumbled across this thread and felt I had to reply. First of all, I can do exactly what you refer to. I have been able to do this since I was a kid. The only way I can explain HOW to do this is that I build up a vacuum in my nasal cavity. This vacuum is created by using the very back of my tongue; I "suck" the soft palate at the back of the nasal cavity backwards. This "vacuum" is what makes it possible to close my nasal passages by pinching the septum in my nose against the inferior turbinate. It's like a valve that shuts. Basically, what I am doing is the opposite of allowing air to flow through my nose (this is exactly what allows water to seep into the nose cavity). I have never been able to teach this, and most people who attempt this make the mistake of releasing air at slow rate through the nose, which is the very opposite of what I am doing. I think an overview (picture) of the nose with its passages would help.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Sun, 02 Jun 2019 05:01:20 GMT

Post #1 Precisely!!

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Sat, 01 Jun 2019 12:46:16 GMT

This had me laughing so hard I choked on my popcorn. This thread is one of the reasons I keep coming back to an otherwise rather quiet forum... amazing. I still can't actually picture what the end point is of the original poster.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Sat, 01 Jun 2019 12:39:52 GMT

This thread is one of the reasons I keep coming back to an otherwise rather quiet forum... amazing. I still can't actually picture what the end point is of the original poster. I just saw this thread for the first time, and I'm trying to figure out what the start point is.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Calvin S — Sat, 01 Jun 2019 09:52:31 GMT

I just saw this thread for the first time, and I'm trying to figure out what the start point is. Post #1

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

__steve__ — Sat, 01 Jun 2019 07:56:48 GMT

The Buteyko breathing course eventually helped me to figure out the key. The key is to control your breathing out using only your lower diaphragm (completely avoid using the upper diaphragm or the muscles around your lungs) to have a stable hold of the whole "air column" in your respiratory system, and at the same time, open your intercostals during the breathout so the airflow becomes so much slighter and so much easier to control (yet even and constant) that you can barely feel it if you put your finger under your nose. This can be done completely consciously and you do not need to be a swimmer or a sportman or in good condition physically to be able to do this breathing technique. Thank you for the information Good to see you mastered this.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Fri, 31 May 2019 15:22:50 GMT

Hello everyone! I am not here to argue or something, but one of you mentioned if I succeed in learning this ability, I should post it. I had septum deviance correction and nasal polyps removal surgery 2 months ago. I went to a mind control course where I could learn to meditate correctly. Went to EMDR therapy so I could overcome my trauma of not being able to do this. Eventually, I went to the Buteyko breathing course, where I learnt everything about breathing and breath control. Now, I can lie on my back on the bottom of the pool face-up with completely clear-of-water nasal cavity and sinuses, without the need to release a single bubble. I've talked to hundreds of people who can do this, yet none of them could tell me the key for it. The Buteyko breathing course eventually helped me to figure out the key. The key is to control your breathing out using only your lower diaphragm (completely avoid using the upper diaphragm or the muscles around your lungs) to have a stable hold of the whole "air column" in your respiratory system, and at the same time, open your intercostals during the breathout so the airflow becomes so much slighter and so much easier to control (yet even and constant) that you can barely feel it if you put your finger under your nose. This can be done completely consciously and you do not need to be a swimmer or a sportman or in good condition physically to be able to do this breathing technique. I am sorry if I've offended anyone on this forum, but I felt the need to at least post the real key of this technique, because I think it is important to explain something to those who have difficulties with this. There may be no one interested in this technique on this forum, but a forum is for information to anyone who comes here. All the best to everyone

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Calvin S — Fri, 31 May 2019 12:14:47 GMT

So... you're still breathing out your nose. Gotcha. I’ll be honest I saw this thread resurrected and saw Jeff had the latest post and my first thought was, “why are you trying to artificially elevate your blood pressure on this wonderful Friday morning by necro-ing this thread?” Then I saw you were replying to OP’s new post and my next thought was, “why is someone trying to artificially elevate Jeff’s blood pressure on this wonderful Friday morning by necro-ing this thread?”

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Jeff Enge — Fri, 31 May 2019 12:02:27 GMT

So... you're still breathing out your nose. Gotcha.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Calvin S — Fri, 31 May 2019 06:34:21 GMT

I mean, seriously... this person went on an odyssey to learn how to lie face up underwater without breathing out their nose and ended up learning how to breathe out their nose, just slowly. This had me laughing so hard I choked on my popcorn.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Jeff Enge — Fri, 31 May 2019 03:05:02 GMT

I’ll be honest I saw this thread resurrected and saw Jeff had the latest post and my first thought was, “why are you trying to artificially elevate your blood pressure on this wonderful Friday morning by necro-ing this thread?” Then I saw you were replying to OP’s new post and my next thought was, “why is someone trying to artificially elevate Jeff’s blood pressure on this wonderful Friday morning by necro-ing this thread?” I mean, seriously... this person went on an odyssey to learn how to lie face up underwater without breathing out their nose and ended up learning how to breathe out their nose, just slowly.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Thu, 21 Feb 2019 15:14:04 GMT

I came to the biggest swimming forum on the web because I couldn't find PROPER answers anywhere else (Hungarian swimming forums/facebook groups for example). I could find some answers on QUORA or REDDIT, and some people answered me on youtube, but I have never managed to find a coherent, detailed description of this technique that takes into consideration every aspect of it. I am going to stop posting to this thread, but I can tell you for sure that I do not misinterprete anything, netheir have I delusions about the existence of this technique, because it exists, period. I can see it IRL with my own eyes... You CAN equalize water pressure with air pressure in the nasal passages, even if you never tried or never wanted to do it, and if you read the comments below the youtube videos I posted, it'll turn out for you really fast what I'm talking about. A LOT OF PEOPLE CAN DO IT, whether you like it or not. If you watch, even Ryan Lochte isn't constantly blowing out bubbles on his back, there are periods when there are no bubbles coming out, you can hate me but it can be seen in the video. In those periods he is doing exactly the same thing I'm describing, as I'm sure we agree on the fact that a professional swimmer won't get his nose flooded underwater OK. I'll accept the fact that you don't tolerate me here, but I won't accept the fact that you simply deny the existence of something just because you are not interested in it at all and slightly call me an idiot for being interested in it, and call me a liar about something you just proved with that Ryan Lochte video, as it can be seen there and in other Ryan Lochte turn youtube videos too... I have my right to be interested in this, you have your right not to be interested in it. That simple. Even I could do it yesterday in the swimming pool a few times, with my screwed up anatomy and nasal health... And I would be pleased if I could at least post a detailed 'how to' based on my researches, gathered information AND experience (as I managed to do it), because if there is only one another idiot like me in this world interested in this crap, he won't find crap on the internet about this and won't understand why he is unable to do it.... But I guess I won't be allowed to make that post anyways... It was not my intention to piss anyone off in here and you are not obligated to read any of my posts here, as I am not obligated to read what I'm not interested in either. If this has nothing to do with professional swimming, then I'm off, but NO FREAKING WONDER you can find nothing on the worldwide web about this if it's so irrelevant to the majority of the people who tend to be oppressive with the minority. no noseclip & no bubbles video: www.youtube.com/watch

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Swimspire — Thu, 21 Feb 2019 12:35:13 GMT

If you're going to practice underwater breath holding, you should read up on shallow water blackout and make sure there is a lifeguard or someone else with you while you try it. swimswam.com/.../

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

67King — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 11:34:06 GMT

I'm not trying to sound like a pompous ass (maybe you're thinking "you're right, you aren't trying, you're succeeding!"). But I'm going to just be blunt. Look, if you really want to do what you describe, this is not the forum to ask, and competitive swimming is not the environment to ask. There is a reason you don't see anyone doing that competitively. It isn't hard to do lying still. I'll admit I messed around a little this morning. It actually isn't impossible doing very slow and easy UDK's. But there's this problem you deal with when you are swimming competitively. Turbulence. You get significant and rapid pressure differences when fluids move over surfaces and shapes, and the nose is absolutely going to be a source for it (credentials - I used to do engine development for a living, and my focus was on the upper end of the engine, so airflow was a HUGE consideration). The faster you go, the more turbulent you get. I'd almost be inclined to tell you to ask some synchronized swimmers. If anyone can do it, and would have a need, it would be them, right? Guess what.......they all wear clips. The video posted is the equivalent of swim lessons for beginners. This iisn't the place for that. This isn't the place to learn lifeguarding strokes like the sidestroke, either. While Masters isn't exclusively for competition, it primarily is. And when you are talking UDK's on your back, you have pretty much ruled out lap swimmers. 1. This is a skill of nearly zero value to competition swimming 2. Not even the best competition swimmers in the world do this 3. It is actually fundamentally opposed to one of the core principals of competitive swimming - do NOT hold your breath 4. Breath control is about exhaling in a controlled manner 5. No one on this forum who has replied, possibly read, has indicated that this is something they can do, or one should do 6. People here think "badass" things to do are swimming really darn fast......which means using a lot of air and needing to breathe more often 7. If you go somewhere seeking advice, don't argue with people when you don't like the advice you are given Either just let it go, or go find advice from a different kind of place that would be more appropriate. This REALLY isn't the place for it.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

__steve__ — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 10:35:29 GMT

This is why I just use a nose clip. Water always enters one side of my nose.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Rob Copeland — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 09:51:28 GMT

First of all I would like to thank you all for your patience with me. I am not a troll, I wish I wasn't serious, as this is driving me crazy too.Stop driving yourself crazy...Get a nose plug and move on. Maybe this is the strangest thread you've seen, Nope; not by a long shot.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:55:19 GMT

First of all I would like to thank you all for your patience with me. I am not a troll, I wish I wasn't serious, as this is driving me crazy too. Maybe this is the strangest thread you've seen, but it just shows the diversity of people... Or my difference from other people haha. When you go face up underwater and do absolutely nothing, water starts filling up your nostril area, then it goes to the nose cavity through the nasal passages, from there it flows forward to your throat and sinuses. Every person has the ability to close their throat and sinuses, but that doesn't help preventing the water from getting into the nose cavity! Some people have the ability to close their nasal passages anatomically, but the majority can only do this with breath control, by "catching" the water at the entrance of the nasal passage and not letting it flowing further, by keeping there an unreleased bubble. You don't only feel when water fills up your nose cavity when face up, you can also see it. Because little bubbles come out of your nose during the process, indicating that the water is pushing air out of the nose cavity and takes its place. When my acquaintances go face-up underwater, you don't see a single bubble leaving their nose, which means the air and the water goes NOWHERE from there, which means they somehow apply a pressure which keeps water out. But only a pressure big enough not to let water in, and small enough not to release a bubble (thus, not wasting their air, which is as I said, awesome, regarding full pool lenght dolphins on your back underwater. What makes it even more wonderful to me that they do it by themselves, without any equipments. It is a marvellous skill that requires sophisticated breath control.). When they surface, they do not have to clear their nose as no water comes out if they start blowing out air. In the youtube video, they don't let water in their nose cavity to be filled up. They start exhaling bubbles strongly, then suddenly stopping the bubbles and catching the water at the entrance of the nasal passages, preventing it from getting in, but not releasing a bubble afterwards. I could show you a lot of youtube videos on this, but I am not sure how many videos I am allowed to post. I would like to show you some examples, so if you'd like to and you're curious, type the following words into the youtube search and you'll see what I mean: underwater living (Ryan Bartholomev's channel) underwater challenge (Brian K's channel) floating face up (Cafeinteraction's channel) underwater horror prank (just for laughs gag's channel) apnea inversa senza ossigeno (David Leonardo Galasso's channel) mowgli staredown challenge (underwater) (Challenge Accepted channel) In some of these videos, surfacing can be also seen (you won't see gallons of water coming outta the nose after the surface)

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Jeff Enge — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 08:38:52 GMT

I just don't know what "valve" you think you're going to learn to close. There is no valve on your nostrils that prevents water from getting in your nose. Really simple fluid mechanics says that anytime the water pressure is greater than the pressure in your nasal cavities, water is going to go in. That's just a fact, you cannot teach yourself to defy physics. You are misinterpreting what your friends are doing, and you're misinterpreting what the videos are showing. Period. The only way you can prevent that negative pressure differential is by blowing out of your nose at least intermittently, suctioning your lip to your nostrils, or repositioning your head so that it's not looking straight up (which is what you're seeing in the first video you posted when the kids are not blowing out). Furthermore, you're trying to "laysplain" to people who have literally decades of experience underwater at myriad angles, some of who have professional training and experience in fields that cover the fluid mechanics that explain this. It's just ridiculous at this point. I, for one, will not be responding anymore.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Elaine Krugman — Wed, 20 Feb 2019 02:20:05 GMT

67, that was an excellent post. :applaud: +1! :agree:

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Former Member — Tue, 19 Feb 2019 13:39:38 GMT

Finally today, one of my biologist friends (whom I told about this the first time and he also saw my CT images) explained to me, that currently it is anatomically impossible for me to do this crap. I am going to a breathing course called "Buteyko" which is known to heal allergy and adenoids and nose breathing... If it doesn't work out, I already have a doctor for septum surgery, because my septum deviance is too big and there is no balance between my two nasal passages... :-) Might as well have an adenoid surgery too, if the spray I got from the doctor turns out to be worthless. I do not care how much it will cost. I won't be able to tolerate that I cannot do something that other people can easily do. I can't get over the fact. You are right, this is very stressful, but I just cannot control my feelings. This was a big lesson for me, three weeks of neuropath misery, and finally it turns out that my failure is not because I'm a jerk.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Redbird Alum — Tue, 19 Feb 2019 12:13:22 GMT

.... that currently it is anatomically impossible for me to do this crap. .... I already have a doctor for septum surgery, because my septum deviance is too big and there is no balance between my two nasal passages... :-) Might as well have an adenoid surgery too, if the spray I got from the doctor turns out to be worthless. I do not care how much it will cost. I won't be able to tolerate that I cannot do something that other people can easily do. ..... Troll or no, I REALLY am looking forward to how this all turns out! Keep us posted!

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Mark Usher — Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:20:53 GMT

I'm suspecting a troll that has really taken us down a crazy road? This.

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

flystorms — Tue, 19 Feb 2019 11:08:34 GMT

I'm suspecting a troll that has really taken us down a crazy road?

RE: underwater face-up with breath control

Jeff Enge — Tue, 19 Feb 2019 09:53:07 GMT

...... Seriously? Dude. Really not that big of a deal.