Should my kids stay on this swim team?

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

gobears — Thu, 02 Aug 2012 08:34:37 GMT

And this athlete protection training protects the athlete? Or USA swimming from lawsuits? Leaving clubs to fend for themselves...... I'm a skeptic.....I hope that one hour video stops someone, but I doubt it. What is it you propose USA swimming should do instead?

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

gdanner — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 10:49:03 GMT

I remember hearing rumors about various male coaches and female swimmers while I was swimming in the 80's. Same here, except into the early 90's. And it resulted in a coach moving out of the state. Someone still coaching to this day. Makes you wonder how many cases have been swept under the rug.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

magick17 — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 09:38:13 GMT

I don't know enough about the situation to comment on it specifically. However, USA Swimming is doing things to help insure the safety of swimmers, including background checks and the athlete safety course. Obviously, none of that matters in a case 30 years old. What you can do as a parent is apply common sense and logic to everything, and make sure your club and coaches do as well. Get involved in your club and USA Swimming and be an active proponent for your club and children. I certainly understand your concerns and would have them myself. Best of luck with your decision. And this athlete protection training protects the athlete? Or USA swimming from lawsuits? Leaving clubs to fend for themselves...... I'm a skeptic.....I hope that one hour video stops someone, but I doubt it.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

gobears — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 08:37:31 GMT

Does anyone else think the culture has changed since the 1980's concerning older men and young girls? I remember hearing rumors about various male coaches and female swimmers while I was swimming in the 80's. I don't remember it being considered pedophilia back then. Scandalous and immoral, yes, but not the sickness it's considered now. I know that's sad, but it's true. I don't have that hard a time believing that a lawyer thought these parents weren't going to get a much better deal back then. Attitudes toward this kind of thing seem to have changed for the better.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

oldwahoo — Wed, 01 Aug 2012 01:17:29 GMT

The team formerly known as Curl-Burke has many outstanding coaches at multiple facilties (including many who swim/coach masters and some I know and whom I would hesitate to have coach my kid) - what may have happened with one can happen anywhere. If you lkike your coach and program, I'd stick with them. As aparent you should always be vigilent no matter the program.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Mon, 30 Jul 2012 16:19:52 GMT

Well, as an update, CUBU did the right thing and sent us an email stating that the name would be changed for the fall season. This was the right move and I think will go a long way toward making parents more comfortable with the club. What's that Shakespeare quote?? "A rose by any other name....."

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Mon, 30 Jul 2012 05:31:06 GMT

I hope these allegations are untrue but mostly I hope this woman finds peace. There is no wait and see with my children. Tarukey, you quit the team yesterday.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

aquageek — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 11:32:49 GMT

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 06:27:29 GMT

By keeping your kids on CuBu, a portion of your $ dues are going into Rick Curl's pocket. Do you really want to help fund RC's legal bills... or his habits?

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 05:47:55 GMT

Apparently he was sued for two million dollars (one million for compensatory damages and one million for punitive damages). They settled for $150K. I am thinking that they had bad legal advice.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

The Fortress — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 03:50:54 GMT

In light of all the attention, I doubt he'd partake in anymore illegal activities (but I guess you never know). I rather wonder what he may have been doing from 1989 on ... pedophiles don't usually stop at one victim. swimswam.com/.../

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

taruky — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 02:31:41 GMT

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

ViveBene — Fri, 27 Jul 2012 02:18:21 GMT

Apparently he was sued for two million dollars (one million for compensatory damages and one million for punitive damages). They settled for $150K. I am thinking that they had bad legal advice. It's quite possible they had bad legal advice, though that would discount the existing culture. In 1960s and 1970s, few victims of sexual harassment had any recourse (why the Clarence Thomas hearings ignited a national spark). H.s. girls were married off over the summer. I imagine there was some ongoing lack of recourse into the 1980s. The legal advisor may have looked at similar cases and seen their outcome. He may have felt $150,000 was the best the family could hope for. He may have seen child victims broken down on the stand and disbelieved. We don't know.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 14:40:06 GMT

I've got to say "Rick Curl" is a great name for a swim coach, kinda sounds like "rip curl" . Obviously I can see both sides of the coin here. In light of all the attention, I doubt he'd partake in anymore illegal activities (but I guess you never know). I suppose you just have to go with your gut and a honest judgement based on your experience and the facts at hand. One option would be to have him quit or take a leave while the legal issues are sorted out. It doesn't seem worth dissolving what seems to be a large and thriving swim program. Once people start bailing usually the whole thing unravels.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 07:41:16 GMT

i swam in that area in the 90's during middle and high school, there are plenty of really good teams to choose from if you decide to jump ship (not for this specific team though). on another note - i really hate how the public jumps absolute decisions. for example, i went to see batman the other week and i can't begin to tell you how many people were surprised i would go see the movie because they think a gunman is going to magically appear at a theater in indiana. this same logic is being applied to bad coaches. just because 1 or 2 people take part in inappropriate behavior - that now most or all of the coaches do to. curl burke employes hundreds of coaches and assistants, i hope that your wife doesn't let a few bad apples spoil it, they are good people.:badday:

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 07:02:37 GMT

If you are comfortable with your children's coach(es) and your children enjoy swimming for that person, don't change teams. CUBU is a large,large team. The actions of one or two coaches of that team should not be used to judge the rest of the coaches. All companies, large or small, there is the chance that a representative of that company will commit an unlawful act(s). That doesn't mean the rest of the company is bad or other people associated with the company. CUBU is no different.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

taruky — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 06:16:38 GMT

You know, one of the things that really upset some of the parents is that one of the coaches went into a diatribe (when asked) about the allegations, saying how Rick Curl is an outstanding citizen, etc. I think a more measured response should be given by all associated with CUBU. The fact is, nobody really knows anyone solely by their public face. I've seen men who look like the nicest guys in the world turn out to be spouse abusers. Joe Paterno was worshipped by many of his players, but we know how that went. While I cannot say with 100% certainty that Rick Curl is guilty, whatever outstanding citizenship he has displayed means nothing in his defense. If someone falsely accused me of inappropriate behavior with a kid, no way on earth I would do anything but fight it. The truth usually comes out. That payoff is indefensible.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

knelson — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 06:06:48 GMT

reachforthewall.com/.../. I wouldn't be surprised if other allegations are made ... It sure is disgusting. The idea that they paid off this family to keep their mouth shut is pretty disturbing. It's hard to imagine Rick Curl (and the Davies family) were the only ones that knew about this. Just seems a little too close to the Penn State affair for my taste. The whole thing is just yucky.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

taruky — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 06:03:48 GMT

I hope that you are not correct that this "probably ... does occur on a regular basis." People who abuse their places of power with children are hopefully few and far between. I also hope that you don't really believe that some of these situations are "the fault of parents..." There is never any excuse for a coach, teacher, scout leader, priest or anyone else to whom we give access to our children, to abuse them. I do not know anything about the team where your son swims. I assume, because of its name, that it is in some way associated with Rick Curl. After reading the news stories and the Settlement Agreement with the pro forma complaint attached, it seems likely that USA Swimming will take some type of action so I think you should weigh weigh how those disruptions would affect the team and in particular your son, when you decide if you should stay or leave. Perhaps I didn't explain myself well. It goes without saying that the perpetrating coach, teacher, etc. is primarily at fault. HOWEVER, I'm not sure if you read the recent story about a 4 year-old boy who shot himself in the head with the gun his step-dad left in the back seat of his unlocked car. There are guns out there, and there are child molesters our there. You take precautions with your children. I would NEVER let my 13 year-old daughter go on a trip alone with a male coach as her caretaker. That is plain stupid. Nor would I let my 16-17 year-old kid leave the pool with his/her coach, or for that matter go out without knowing her whereabouts. I'm pretty sure these coaches pick the low hanging fruit.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

swimshark — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 05:19:12 GMT

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

no200fly — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 04:44:20 GMT

I realize that this probably has occurred or does occur on a widespread basis, and in the case of Rick Curl the alleged period of impropriety was 30 years ago. I tend to believe that some of these situations are the fault of parents, who freely let their children go to out of town swim meets alone with coaches, or who let them give rides, etc. I would like to believe that I could protect my child whether a coach has done something wrong in the past or not. My son really loves (in an appropriate way) his swim coach, they have a great rapport. His swimming has taken off with this guy. I see potential conflict with my wife on this. I hope that you are not correct that this "probably ... does occur on a regular basis." People who abuse their places of power with children are hopefully few and far between. I also hope that you don't really believe that some of these situations are "the fault of parents..." There is never any excuse for a coach, teacher, scout leader, priest or anyone else to whom we give access to our children, to abuse them. I do not know anything about the team where your son swims. I assume, because of its name, that it is in some way associated with Rick Curl. After reading the news stories and the Settlement Agreement with the pro forma complaint attached, it seems likely that USA Swimming will take some type of action so I think you should weigh weigh how those disruptions would affect the team and in particular your son, when you decide if you should stay or leave.

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

swimshark — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 04:24:37 GMT

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

orca1946 — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 03:29:59 GMT

Don't start some where else not knowing any more about that team than you already know about the team & well working group you now have !:2cents:

RE: Should my kids stay on this swim team?

The Fortress — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 02:09:19 GMT

reachforthewall.com/.../. I wouldn't be surprised if other allegations are made ... I know my daughter's swim team has been getting calls about availability from freaked out parents.