Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

orca1946 — Mon, 30 Jul 2012 07:15:13 GMT

If kids spent as much time being healthy & learning to swim & do activities - that does not make texting an activity, then yes it should be taught BUT how do they do this & enforce it ?

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Redbird Alum — Mon, 30 Jul 2012 01:11:13 GMT

Beyond access to a pool... schools are already hacking away at anything that doesn't smack of results directly related to government regulatory measures and/or ACT/SAT scores. Taxpayers would have to pony up to add this course (whether onsite, or not) and most schools not located in wealthy suburbs are having a hard enough time just keeping the lights on. Until schools can handle the basics, don't expect any new "mandatory" wishes to be granted.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Sat, 28 Jul 2012 13:34:33 GMT

In the 1950s more than half of US colleges had a swimming requirement, but now all except for a handful have dropped it. I think mandatory swim tests, as they are constructed today, are a poor measure of swimming ability, as they usually only require jumping in and swimming a few lengths of the pool. Much better would be requiring freshmen to take a comprehensive swimming course which would emphasize basic aquatic and survival skills. Berea College in Kentucky is the only school I know of that has such a requirement. My area does offer a lot of opportunities for kids to learn to swim. The YMCAs have a very extensive year-round program for teaching children up to about age 12, as do several community organizations. Local colleges offer juvenile swim classes on the weekends or during the summer. It doesn't seem feasible financially for elementary and middle schools to require swimming. I suppose high schools require it because they can better afford it, the fact that the schools have swim teams and the adoption of a more expansive concept of physical fitness which offers more fitness alternatives for students than old-style PE. Also, teachers and administrators may believe that high school is the time to catch all remaining young people who still have not learned how to swim, most of whom are assumed to have learned in their earlier years. I think a common theme in this thread is the many unexpected difficulties in actually implementing a mass instructional aquatics program for all school children. Also, how good are the results--how well do these programs actually do in making kids safe in the water? How good are the teachers? I'm afraid there is evidence that the quality of swim instruction for all ages in this country may be deficient. Maybe this is a subject for another thread, but why, according to polls, is the number of adults in the US with weak or no swimming skills so shockingly high? More adults drown than children. If learn-to-swim classes are so common, why are so many adults unable to swim? I 'm not sure of the answer. Maybe that's a convincing reason for requiring all high school students if not all college freshmen to take swimming.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

swimcat — Sat, 28 Jul 2012 08:50:14 GMT

We had to take a swimming class in college if we couldnt pass a swim test . It was like 25 yards. As a lifeguard i had to tread water in the middle and wait

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 16:58:27 GMT

A bit off topic, but a timely article about a non-profit addressing this issue: The Boston Globe - Thursday, July 26, 2012 Mandatory swimming lessons a lifeline in Boston The Boys & Girls Club of Boston is nearly one year into an initiative requiring all members to take swim lessons. The program, launched last fall, is part of an aggressive approach to combat child drowning deaths — especially among the city’s black and Hispanic children, who are at a significantly higher risk of drowning. The approach taken by the Boys & Girls Club of Boston mirrors efforts nationwide to increase swimming rates among children of color. www.bostonglobe.com/.../story.html

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 14:15:49 GMT

I think the biggest issue here is that the elementary schools don't typically have pools, at least where I live. If you're teaching them to swim in High School, I feel like the greatest threat of downing has already occurred. Most of the people you would have saved from drowning would already be dead. The stats show ages 1-5 is at the greatest risk. Why wait until middle or high school? The value of the program would substantially decrease if you waited an extra 10+ years. The next group of at risk swimmers is young adults (14-24?). It'd be interesting to see how many of these people considered themselves competent swimmers. I think this increase in drowning is likely due to stupidity- not knowing one's limits, not swimming where it's safe, alcohol induced swimming, and swimming a lone or with less attention than a youngster. Another important factor we haven't really talked about is who is teaching these children. I'd imagine most elementary school gym classes have 20, 30, maybe even 40+ kids to 1 or 2 teachers. That's a lot of children to oversee especially when they have no ability in the water. Then you'll also need lifeguards or TA's trained as lifeguards to oversee the pool. If the school has the resources to reasonably teach early childhood swimming, I am all for it. I don't think it's a practical solution in most places. As with learning most anything outside (or maybe even inside) of school at a young age, it really comes down to the parents responsibility to provide the resources. If you're waiting until middle or high school to teach swimming, I think it's way too late. I think the purpose here is not to make them professional athletes, but rather to provide safety skills and who knows, maybe get some kids interested in the sport. I think a better idea might be preschools contracting swim programs with local pools. It seems like it would be a better age and more realistic.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 12:43:36 GMT

I've long been thinking about this topic. I don't know whether I favor mandatory swimming classes in high school. All three comprehensive high schools in my city in Wisconsin require learning to swim. Students have to receive a passing grade in at least one swimming unit in PE in order to graduate. I believe many other high schools in Wisconsin, at least in the larger towns, require it as well, a situation probably comparable to that in prevailing in other states also. The state doesn't require it, leaving it up to the local districts to decide. School districts are hard-pressed financially and some have eliminated swimming entirely from the curriculum. Swimming instruction in school is free and taking a required swim class in high school might be the last time a student will ever have a chance to learn to swim. People should at least acquire enough aquatic skill to be safe in the water. Taking a swimming class need not be required to graduate but passing a mandatory swim test might be. I worry that an aquaphobic student might be traumatized for life in a high school swim class and never like the water or learn to swim. Non-swimming children are already in the minority by the time they reach their teens, and forcing them to participate in a swimming class in front their peers could be humiliating and would add greatly to their anxiety. The biggest problem encountered by physical educators is dealing with the great range of athletic abilities found among students. Some young people have superior aquatic ability and could qualify to be on the swim team. Most have average aquatic skills. A few have no swimming skills whatsoever and may never have been in the water. For these young people, acquiring the most basic skills can be extremely difficult. They pose special difficulties for PE teachers who may not know how to work with this population. As an aquaphobe myself who has struggled with this for years, I know how hard this can really be. I've heard that in a local high school non-swimming students are taken from the rest of the class and taught basic swimming skills apart from the other students, although in the same pool. They learn to swim perfectly well by the end of the unit. Very fearful students can get a doctor's excuse to get out of taking the class, but I believe, in practice, few actually do. If learning to swim is to be required, then why not offer special instruction one-on-one after school or on weekends where the student can move at his own pace with few others present and is not conscious of the scrutiny of his peers? Why not offer swimming instruction off school grounds in other facilities in the community or even in backyard pools, where students could get free lessons from an instructor certified to teach anxious students in a calm and relaxed setting? Students might be allowed several years to gain the required level of skill, if that's what it takes. After completing instruction, students could then successfully pass the swimming test required to graduate. I'm no expert, but that's my take on it, for what it's worth.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

philoswimmer — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 10:29:58 GMT

Dartmouth College has a swimming test required for graduation -- I remember it as 100 yds, but website says 50 yds, so who knows, memory is faulty. Most students take the test their freshman year. I always assumed the requirement had something to do with the fact that Dartmouth is adjacent to the Connecticut River.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Thu, 26 Jul 2012 06:10:43 GMT

Ok. Let's make that 6th grade

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Wed, 25 Jul 2012 15:52:57 GMT

Our HS has one of the nicest aquatic facilities in the area(central PA) and used to have mandatory 1st&4th&9th grade aquatic instruction.For 10 days kids got bussed to the pool-received 45 minutes of small group instruction and most ended up with decent swimming skills.However,budget cuts have now eliminated the elementary aquatics education,and the instructors have been laid off.That leaves 9th grade-and in the past by that point instruction had shifted to lifesaving skills around water,boating safety and snorkeling.I am not sure what the SD is trying to accomplish here. At least the facility has a comunity aquatics program that offers swim instruction from the littlest kids,swim team,lifeguard training and such.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Wed, 25 Jul 2012 13:06:07 GMT

I don't think that lessons should be required. But i don't think anyone should be allowed to graduate high school without first passing a swimming test.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 13:48:06 GMT

It seems to me that swimming instruction would be much more important than some of the sports we had to learn back in school (70's), such as gymnastics. Nothing against gymnastics (I love watching it in the Olympics), but a balance beam isn't exactly something kids have easy access to, once they graduate. (That was one of the things I was required in PE to learn how to do...) And, how life-threatening would it be if I had never learned how to do a routine on the uneven parallel bars? This was, largely, my experience as well: elementary gymnastics, trampoline jumping and other stuff we’d never do again, along with endless hours of volleyball. The real sin, though, was that during the years we were in Junior High, boys had gym class at a YMCA down the street. For two hours a day, one day a week, each gym class (group of about 25) had complete use of the Y’s gym and pool, yet the “teacher” opted to use the pool for only an hour every other week or so, and then for an unstructured free swim or for water volleyball (yes, more volleyball). Although I had a sense that most students could swim at least a little, most were not strong swimmers (myself included), so there was a huge lost opportunity here to teach something useful. (I’m assuming a phys. Ed. teacher must be qualified to teach swimming). Our teacher’s “involvement” at the pool was about the same as it was in the gym: sitting on a chair on the pool deck, reading a newspaper, with an occasional glance toward the pool to make sure no one was drowning. Sad, but true.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

knelson — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 12:45:23 GMT

I consider myself lucky that both my junior high and high school had pools. I got in lots of swimming in PE classes! It's interesting how this seems very dependent on location. I grew up in Michigan and high schools have pools as a rule. My school had just a four lane 25 yard pool, but it was a pool. We didn't need to leave the campus for swim practice. Here in Wahsington high school pools are much rarer (at least on the west side of the state). Even Lakeside, the exclusive private school up the road from my house where Bill Gates and Paul Allen graduated, does not have a pool and the campus looks like an Ivy League college in miniature! All the high schools--public and private--have to fight for pool time at off-campus pools.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

smontanaro — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 02:30:38 GMT

Pool availability is definitely the key component here. I live in Evanston, IL, which is right on Lake Michigan (Evanston is, not my house - don't I wish!). The accessibility of the lake has always been one of the excuses not to build a public pool. This seems kind of dumb to me on a few counts: The lake is only warm enough to swim in perhaps four months of the year (guessing July to October, often still too cold in June) The beaches are only staffed with lifeguards three months of the year (Memorial Day to Labor Day) The proximity to the sanitary canal in Wilmette means the beaches are frequently closed because of high e coli levels Even when it's open and pollution is low enough, it might be too cold or too rough for novice swimmers - even when it's hot, westerly winds drive upwelling which brings cold water up from the bottom of the lake - brrr! A toddler nearly drowned about a week ago (the kid's fine from what I heard). Apparently, the lifeguards squeezed down on the north/south limits of the swimming area after that incident, so on a brutally hot day later that week everyone was crammed in a small "swimming area" like sardines. Evanston only has private pools (private in the sense that they aren't operated by the city), at Evanston Township High School (mostly closed to non-school activities - though there is a USMS team there), Northwestern University (faculty, staff and students only, unless you are fairly wealthy), the YMCA, the YWCA (very short "open swim" hours) and Evanston Athletic Club (really only caters to adults). The YMCA is really the city's "public pool", but it's not cheap to join, and you can't just drop in a pay a couple bucks to hang out for the day. It strikes me as very short-sighted for a city the size of Evanston (80,000-ish) to not have even one truly public pool where kids can learn to swim or swim in a more controlled environment than Lake Michigan. (This is a city which not that long ago won the Illinois state boys high school championship.) Other Chicago suburbs have outdoor pools with typical "kiddie water park" features. Those might seem frivolous, but I think they attract families to these facilities and make it more likely that kids will learn to swim. Also, Chicago, has a much huge stretch of coastline (20-some-odd miles, much of it with beaches and lifeguards) and has both indoor and outdoor pools dotted all over the city. Of course, it's a much bigger city, but it still seems that Evanston should have at least one public pool, especially considering the fact that Evanston has a sizable African American population and the statistics about African Americans and swimming. Just one data point... Skip

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

joel schmaltz — Tue, 24 Jul 2012 01:37:47 GMT

Pool availability is definitely the key component here. If pool access is availible then I think swim lessons/classes should be strongly encouraged. Here in SC there are very few pools around. Maybe because we live on the coast and the beach is right here. You would think being in a warm climate ,95 degrees with a heat index of 110 today, there would be pools everywhere. Even with our masters meets we go to the same pools every year. I have a friend that is a principle of a high school 20 min away from here who says some of his students have never even seen the ocean. The culture that some of our children are raised in teaches them that if they go into the water they will die. Maybe that is easier than teaching kids and adults how to swim. What a shame! Everyone should learn how to swim. At the very least be taught not to panic and get themselves out of a situation in the water. Especially if you live near the water.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 12:45:17 GMT

I think it really comes down to the parents to get their kids proficient with swimming. The schools won't pay for it unless they have easy access to a pool. Plus they wouldn't want to cut in to any educational time. I learned to swim at what now is a Y taking swim lessons. Poor, inner city children are the least likely to swim, so they should make sure kids can get lessons. Stew Leonard, owner of Stew Leonard's (organic grocery store chain in CT and NY) is a bajillionaire who lives in CT. It's a small chain but famous in the northeast. People comes from Vermont and New Hampshire to CT just to buy food. Anways, his son drowned as a toddler so he always puts ads on the radio promoting swim safety. They also raise and donate money for "scholarships" for children to attend swim lessons. He went to jail for tax evasion, but he's devoted his life to raise awareness, educate, and prevent drownings. So that's kinda cool. www.stewietheduck.com/home.cfm

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 09:33:11 GMT

Although I think swimming is a great sport and think everyone should know how to swim, I don't think it would really make sense to make lessons mandatory. As a practical matter, I think you are correct. Kids need to be taught when they are young, and swimming pools are largely unknown at elementary schools (let alone the staff needed to teach). And given the state of municipal finances everywhere, there is no practical likelihood that the pools would be built or the staff hired (nor is there the political will to make it happen). I'm hardly an advocate of the "nanny state," but the concept is at least thought-provoking. At the end of the day, parents need to take responsibility to see that their kids learn.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 08:45:09 GMT

Although I think swimming is a great sport and think everyone should know how to swim, I don't think it would really make sense to make lessons mandatory. It seems like most drowning happens to young children. I may be wrong, but most elementary schools do not have pools. I've never seen one around here it least. It's not until middle school or even high schools that public schools are equipped. Middle school pools are rare though too. If you're waiting until middle or high school to make swim lessons mandatory, the majority of the years at which children are at the highest risk have already passed. I think the group most at risk for drowning is ages 1-5 and it's usually in pools. The second highest is mid teens to early 20's but in lakes, rivers, ocean, etc. I think that probably has mostly to do with stupidity and risk taking than skill. Blacks and Hispanics also have substantially higher drowning rates. I think it's essential for all kids to take swim lessons at an early age (but not those nut cases that teach 3 month old babies how not to drown). I'd like to think swimming opportunities should be provided as much as possible to students as they grow. If the schools have pools, they should take advantage of them and integrate them into physical education. High school girls wouldn't want to get their hair wet though, so idk how that would work. Very few public schools in CT have pools. They're obviously expensive to build maintain and it's probably cheaper to just rent lanes elsewhere. A lot of schools don't "have time" for PE anymore too. I heard that in the middle school I attended students now must write essays in PE once a week instead of playing sports. What is the world coming to.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Bobinator — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 06:42:17 GMT

At the very least every student in middle school or high school should have a water safety class that covers: a) spinal injuries from diving into shallow or murky water (especially after storms), b)Basic parenting skills around lakes and pool(I know this stuff is obvious and brain-dead for swimmers but you'd be surprised in normal populations), Basic boating safety(mandatory laws concerning pfd's because this is the only place they'll get it and it's very important if you are out of shape and can't swim very far), how to swim in a rip current, WHAT A DROWNING VICTIM REALLY LOOKS LIKE (not at all what you'd expect), what you can do to help a drowning victim without getting yourself in danger, CPR or even a link to the "hands-only" chest compressions, basic safety for home pools when you have little ones around. There's more thaan this but these are the things that come to my mind when I think about what I teach in summer school water safety class. Unless families seek this information out from the YMCA, or Red Cross the school is probably the only place young adults will get it. Learning to swim in PE class is tough since most of our classes have 40+ kids in them and meet on a fairly inconsistant basis.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Elaine Krugman — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 06:00:31 GMT

I would like to see swimming instruction required at schools that already have a pool on campus or where a community pool is located nearby. For schools with that kind of access to a pool, the cost of administering a swim program would be worth it, considering the lives that could potentially be saved. For students who already know how to swim, passing a swim test would excuse them from the program. It seems to me that swimming instruction would be much more important than some of the sports we had to learn back in school (70's), such as gymnastics. Nothing against gymnastics (I love watching it in the Olympics), but a balance beam isn't exactly something kids have easy access to, once they graduate. (That was one of the things I was required in PE to learn how to do...) And, how life-threatening would it be if I had never learned how to do a routine on the uneven parallel bars? But, growing up in California, I couldn't imagine not knowing how to swim, as much as I was around water. Thankfully, the American Red Cross taught free lessons down at the bay; myfirst introduction to learning how to swim. Kudos to Cullen Jones for his involvement with Make a Splash! :applaud:To think where he has come, since almost drowning, because he didn't know how to swim as a child... :bow:

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:54:02 GMT

In some places and times in European hisotry there was a requirement for knights to swim. I ahve even read of a requirement to swim a certain distance - short presumably- in armour. I'm guessing that would be in seriously maritime districts and when armour was somewhat minimal, can't imagine trying to swim even a few feet in a full suit of armour. Wasn't breaststroke the stroke to do? The freestyle crawl was "barbaric".

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

knelson — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:39:27 GMT

As a practical matter, I think you are correct. Kids need to be taught when they are young, and swimming pools are largely unknown at elementary schools The pool doesn't have to be onsite. Kids could be bussed to local pools. I don't think swimming lessons should be mandatory--there are just too many areas where the facilities wouldn't be available--but in cases where pools are available it should be highly encouraged. Yes, it would be expensive, but it would absolutely save lives.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

TRYM_Swimmer — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:10:17 GMT

www.trymca.org/.../ 3rd & 4th Grade Water Safety Program In collaboration with Craven County Schools, 4th Graders in the Spring and 3rd Graders in the Fall learn lifesaving ifelong skills such as wearing a PFD, swim instruction, general water safety instruction. Over 1000 children served annually and supported by the Twin Rivers YMCA Annual Scholarship Support Program. ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- There is no pass or fail, just good information for kids in this area of two rivers, 40 miles from the ocean. This is a community effort, in which a number of USMS members spend time every year as volunteer teachers. Every child in the county is involved at some point.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

Former Member — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:09:31 GMT

Should swimming instruction be mandatory as part of physical education/gym classes in public schools? I think it should be part of the curriculum of any school on the shore or in lake country. Possibly every school. A couple of generations ago, it was still a remnant of some class thing: the upper classes learned to swim. At some point, maybe late 19th century, the entry to the upper class in this sense was high school (You also had to learn a foreign language to graduate at that point,. Just a reference point.) In some places and times in European hisotry there was a requirement for knights to swim. I ahve even read of a requirement to swim a certain distance - short presumably- in armour. I'm guessing that would be in seriously maritime districts and when armour was somewhat minimal, can't imagine trying to swim even a few feet in a full suit of armour.

RE: Mandatory Swimming Classes in School?

knelson — Mon, 23 Jul 2012 05:04:32 GMT

I think the group most at risk for drowning is ages 1-5 and it's usually in pools. You are correct. Here are some stats about drownings: www.cdc.gov/.../