Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 06:23:03 GMT

O K- Let us know how this turns out!!?? It went pretty well. I don't have my "split" yet, but now that I am an Expert, just having swum the best and most spectacular 400 IM that I will ever swim, I will definitively say that the 400 IM is a lot easier than the 200 fly. At least the way I do it :D Nobody complained that I know of. The ref asked if I was doing it for fun or if I needed a split request. I said I was doing it for "fun". The one guy next to me (I was in lane 1) seemed cool with it too. I would expect any complaints to be coming from the spectators who had to witness my open backstroke turns and whatever it is that I do that technically counts as breaststroke. They may never un-see it. My sincerest apologies to them :)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

The Fortress — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 04:46:22 GMT

Ah, Fort, we'll miss seeing you tomorrow! Coming down next month for the big one? I would have come down but for a local meet this Sunday! I will definitely be there for Nationals in April. :)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

orca1946 — Sat, 03 Mar 2012 04:27:47 GMT

O K- Let us know how this turns out!!?? Tell all & ref. what your intentions are & you should be ok.

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

That Guy — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 11:38:37 GMT

so swimming the 800/1000 for a split during the 1500/1650 is awesome. Do that each year in each course and that's 6 events for the price of 3! But wait... what about the Checkoff Challenge? Ya need the 800/1000 as a standalone event amirite? So that's an awesome excuse to swim an 800 IM! :banana:

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

Former Member — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 10:09:44 GMT

Well, when they're lapping me while I'm swimming backstroke and breaststroke, they can feel really fast :) Don't worry, I think they find ways to be mad at you whether you're significantly faster or slower than they are. ;)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

Former Member — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 09:45:10 GMT

Distance swimmers might hate you afterwards though because it messes up their "pace". Whatever that is. :P

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 08:51:16 GMT

Just let's be clear that a real sprinter would never engage in this foolishness. Indeed. I am definitely conflicted. And two months of HIT does not a sprinter make. Someday! Complaining seems to come naturally, though :D

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

jaadams1 — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 08:43:06 GMT

I've done the same thing as all Fly for 500s and a 1000. I've also done a 1000 Reverse IM as well. Like others said: Tell your neighbors, and possibly the ref. Also...no pulling on the lanelines...that's another DQable offense. :D

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

TRYM_Swimmer — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 08:38:33 GMT

Just let's be clear that a real sprinter would never engage in this foolishness.:) Ah, Fort, we'll miss seeing you tomorrow! Coming down next month for the big one?

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

The Fortress — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 07:58:31 GMT

(yes, sprinter whining) Just let's be clear that a real sprinter would never engage in this foolishness.:)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 07:37:24 GMT

Cool. I'll be informing the ref and my heatmates. Thanks everyone!

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

Patrick W. Brundage — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 06:26:09 GMT

Sickfish -- I'm doing essentially the same thing at a meet on March 11th, swimming the 400 IM in a 1000 free event because the meet organizers saw fit to add silly, illegitimate 25s* into the meet program instead of the 400 IM! I'm doing what Rob suggests: - inform the referee (the person standing next to the starter, blowing the whistle) - mention it to the swimmers next to you in the heat - make sure you swim the entire 500 *To show my support for the illegitimate events, though, I'll be racing my 25 fly and 25 free in the greatest swimsuit ever invented (blueseventy.com/.../).

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:48:11 GMT

I have seen someone DQ'd swimming breaststroke during a freestyle race because the swimmer's whole body went under (as the breaststroke rules permit) during the last 10m of a length. Yeah, my breaststroke is nowhere near good enough to do that. I'm not even going to attempt any of that newfangled underwater pull and kick stuff. Just push off, maybe glide until I need air (two seconds, tops), and start "swimming" "breaststroke". fantastic 400IM For me, just having finished it will be fantastic enough :D

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

ourswimmer — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:39:03 GMT

Freestylers should not have an issue... they are the only stroke where the rules come down to: Stay off the bottom Touch the wall at each end Don't forget the 15m rule. I have seen someone DQ'd swimming breaststroke during a freestyle race because the swimmer's whole body went under (as the breaststroke rules permit) during the last 10m of a length. You may not care, as long as the swim gives you the information you need. After all, even if you do not DQ it will go down in your USMS Permanent Record as a meh 500 rather than as a fantastic 400IM + 100EZ. I have a lot of 50s and 100s "free" in the USMS database that are really 50s and 100s backstroke. Just let others know, and no one will mind that you get what you want out of the swim.

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

rxleakem — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:24:03 GMT

Thanks for the post, Sick. I am planning to do the same thing in April - never done one in a meet before. Swim fast! :)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:17:21 GMT

Standing on the bottom during a freestyle race shall not disqualify a swimmer, but a swimmer must not leave the pool, or walk, or spring from the bottom. Sweet. Although, just knowing that I'm allowed to stop and stand around is going to drastically increase the likelihood of there being a guy stopped in the middle of the pool during one of the 500 heats at Greensboro tomorrow. I expect that the pool will be too deep for me to effectively stand, though :(

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

aquageek — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:11:42 GMT

Freestylers should not have an issue... they are the only stroke where the rules come down to: Stay off the bottom Touch the wall at each end It is perfectly legal to stand on the bottom of the pool in freestyle. Standing on the bottom during a freestyle race shall not disqualify a swimmer, but a swimmer must not leave the pool, or walk, or spring from the bottom. Standing on the bottom during any other stroke shall result in disqualification. But, since it is freestyle, you can stop during any of the strokes you are doing and hang out and catch your breath.

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

Redbird Alum — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 05:03:00 GMT

Freestylers should not have an issue... they are the only stroke where the rules come down to: Stay off the bottom Touch the wall at each end

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

sickfish — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 04:55:02 GMT

It is a freestyle event so the rules of freestyle apply and the time will count as a 500 free, unless you get out at the 400 in which case the swim won't count and you will be DQ'd. Ok cool, that's what I thought. 1. Putting an unrealistic seed time and finishing well before or after your heat mates. 2. Getting out at the 400 simply because you can. Hit the wall at the 400 and then do an easy 100 to finish. I seeded myself with seven minutes... the more I think about it, the more pessimistic I get (yes, sprinter whining), but I think it's realistic enough. My last (and only) 200IM was just under a 2:30, so I doubled that, added some padding for even more abominable breaststroke and tacked on another 1:30 for the last 100. If I go under 7, I'll be satisfied, and if not, well, all the more reason to never do it again :) As long as you don’t violate freestyle rules, you can’t be DQ’ed for stroke infractions. E.g. you can legally 1-hand fly/*** turns, etc. No worries there. I'm going to do everything as legally as possible. Distance swimmers might hate you afterwards though because it messes up their "pace". Whatever that is. :P Well, when they're lapping me while I'm swimming backstroke and breaststroke, they can feel really fast :)

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

Rob Copeland — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 04:38:17 GMT

There is no written rule. But I suggest you: - inform the referee (the person standing next to the starter, blowing the whistle) - mention it to the swimmers next to you in the heat - make sure you swim the entire 500 Note: As long as you don’t violate freestyle rules, you can’t be DQ’ed for stroke infractions. E.g. you can legally 1-hand fly/*** turns, etc.

RE: Etiquette question: 400IM instead of 500 free

aquageek — Fri, 02 Mar 2012 04:32:54 GMT

It is a freestyle event so the rules of freestyle apply and the time will count as a 500 free, unless you get out at the 400 in which case the swim won't count and you will be DQ'd. I would tell everyone within ear and eye shot what you are going to do, especially those beside you and maybe even the head ref. It isn't required. I think the only two poor forms of etiquette when doing this are: 1. Putting an unrealistic seed time and finishing well before or after your heat mates. 2. Getting out at the 400 simply because you can. Hit the wall at the 400 and then do an easy 100 to finish. See you tomorrow at the meet I suspect. Best of luck.