Nationals Kudos

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Thu, 30 Oct 2025 21:08:12 GMT

A must-read for anyone still pretending this fiasco is about ‘inclusion.’ It’s about integrity, and USMS leadership seems allergic to it. Remember when they chose to stand behind one individual instead of the many women their policy betrayed? It's time for a change!

The Scandal of Ana Caldas, and the Case for Sex Screening in Female Athletics

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Mon, 16 Jun 2025 21:01:19 GMT

www.usms.org/.../interim-eligibility-policy

RE: Nationals Kudos

Kathy Piech-Lukas — Mon, 16 Jun 2025 20:59:28 GMT

Did everyone get the email today with the new USMS interim eligibility policy?

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Tue, 20 May 2025 12:02:35 GMT

swimswam.com/.../

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Tue, 20 May 2025 11:53:15 GMT

An article in SwimSwam reports Texas looking at issue of transgender person swimming in championship meet in San Antonio.

RE: Nationals Kudos

02TN1 — Mon, 12 May 2025 20:10:13 GMT

Late to the party here Angie. Have never joined a chat on USMS. There seem to be not near enough people commenting. That petition circulated around our Masters group and was well-received by folks on both sides of the aisle. We're with you guys. Press on this bruise and let's get fairness back in the competition pool. Everyone is welcome but real men and women must stay in their lane. Another issue even more important to me than the pool is the sanctity of women's intimate spaces. My wife and daughter are swimmers. I'm a grandfather now. My three granddaughters may very well be swimmers. Let's keep our (and one day their) intimate spaces for real females only!

RE: Nationals Kudos

GrantD63 — Mon, 12 May 2025 13:39:13 GMT

Well done!

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Sat, 10 May 2025 08:49:22 GMT

Thank you 🤗

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Sat, 10 May 2025 08:48:55 GMT

Thank You Sarah!

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Fri, 09 May 2025 22:00:44 GMT

Shout to Wendy for speaking up!

youtu.be/SfxQ91sbu_I

RE: Nationals Kudos

Kyle Deery — Fri, 09 May 2025 15:43:13 GMT

USMS is monitoring media reports, comments on these forums, and responding to member inquiries on the allegations regarding the eligibility of one of our members. We felt it might be helpful to provide updates here to ensure those on this thread are aware of the steps we are taking.

We have also created a 2025 Spring Nationals Eligibility Review Updates thread. All future updates from USMS will be posted here.

Over the past week, USMS has received several formal eligibility review requests. In keeping with our published policy, the eligibility review panel was convened late last week to gather and assess the facts. Those with standing who have requested an eligibility review have been notified and will receive updates directly from the panel as appropriate. The panel will make a final determination based on the evidence presented. Speculation or commentary outside the review will not be part of the decision.

Many members have contacted us with questions and suggestions about our transgender eligibility policy. After the eligibility review is complete, USMS leadership and relevant committees will take time to reflect on member input and other details that emerge from the process to determine whether updates to the policy are appropriate and in line with USMS’s mission and values.

We ask for your patience as this process continues, and we thank you for being part of a community that values thoughtful and respectful dialogue, integrity, and the shared love of swimming.

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Thu, 08 May 2025 00:43:50 GMT

www.change.org/FairnessInSport

Sign this petition to urge USMS to take action. Let’s work together to protect the integrity of competition while making sure everyone has a place in the sport we love.

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Wed, 07 May 2025 19:45:41 GMT

Your article is excellent.

RE: Nationals Kudos

ourswimmer — Wed, 07 May 2025 15:50:31 GMT

Nobody has to provide advance proof of sex (or age) to register for USMS or to enter events. Proof, whether of being trans and eligible or of not being trans, is necessary only if an eligibility protest occurs.

Who would volunteer to run a meet or open water event if sanctioning required the race director to verify every entrant's sex? Who would enter a meet or open water event if entry requirements included submitting sensitive personal medical information?

RE: Nationals Kudos

0AUS0 — Wed, 07 May 2025 15:17:22 GMT

Swimmers who identify as transgender are not required to provide documentation on eligibility to participate. Those striving to achieve official forms of recognition are strongly encouraged to submit a pre-event eligibility request

this is nuts they they are not required to but encouraged provide documentation…

I will be boycotting usms if the policy is not amended to support women

RE: Nationals Kudos

005AX — Tue, 06 May 2025 20:54:27 GMT

Beautifully written, Angie!

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Tue, 06 May 2025 20:06:00 GMT

The issue is more that the inclusion of transgender folks in women's swimming excludes women. There are fairer ways to have trans folks included that does not penalize ciswomen.

RE: Nationals Kudos

Angie Griffin — Tue, 06 May 2025 19:23:49 GMT

www.swimmingworldmagazine.com/.../

RE: Nationals Kudos

ourswimmer — Tue, 06 May 2025 03:07:54 GMT

If you are bound and determined to reverse-engineer a justification for your position, I can't stop you.

On the other hand, if you'd like to read about NQTs and how the Championship Committee actually determines them, you can read the FAQs that I linked for you. The whole point of the system that uses a three-year rolling average of the 10th place time (from the Top Ten, not from Nationals) is to make sure that one super-fast person, regardless of the life history explanation for the person's speed, doesn't skew the NQT to be so fast that it cuts off too many people.

You also can look up the 10th fastest times in, say, the W50-54 1000 for the past five or ten years, and see for yourself what time progression caused the NQT to get faster. No single person is responsible for that phenomenon. The only way you can call any trans women responsible for that phenomenon at all is to assume that not just one but multiple women in that age group are both fast and trans, which I maintain is a ludicrous assumption.

A person who was comparatively fast as a man is likely to be comparatively faster as a woman, true. But such people are very uncommon, both because trans women are not common and because trans women who went through boy-to-man puberty while training at a high level in swimming are even less common. USMS policy should reflect these facts, as well as our values of fair competition and inclusion, and I recognize and respect that someone whose priorities differ from mine might come to a different conclusion about what that policy should be. I don't respect exaggeration or scare-mongering.

RE: Nationals Kudos

GrantD63 — Tue, 06 May 2025 00:45:45 GMT

Wrong! I said this "woman” highly affects the NQT…not women. But since you raise the issue, yes…if MULTIPLE athletes in ANY division or age group are using an unfair advantage of any sort, then do the math. There was no assertion and you should read posts more carefully before spouting off. Sure, in my example race the 10th place wasn’t “blazing”, but then how do you explain the 1:30 DROP on NQT? Did the other higher places over three years skew this? They HAD TO or there wouldn’t have been such a time drop. There’s another thread about testosterone and how men having prostate removal surgery are getting prescription T therapy and are swimming faster and setting records. To be clear, my point was and is there’s a LOT going on outside of the pool that USMS needs to start addressing if they really want to define inclusion and fairness properly.

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Tue, 06 May 2025 00:06:36 GMT

Angie. write to the Rules committee

rules@usmastersswimming.org

get a bunch of folks to write them..I did Many folks are really angry

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Mon, 05 May 2025 02:55:37 GMT

Paul, I have missed your comments since the format changed and life shifted. Very glad to be reading you again. I do have a question about your last sentence. I hope you meant that it is important to be honest with folks and that boundaries need to be set for folks (as in any mental illness.) Thanks.

I hope you continue to swim.

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Mon, 05 May 2025 02:48:41 GMT

perhaps, but her situation should have been known. and she would have had to give her credentials to usms..if she didn't that is a different realm.

RE: Nationals Kudos

sarah tyler — Mon, 05 May 2025 02:42:56 GMT

if she was confirmed in the past folks should have known that..

RE: Nationals Kudos

ourswimmer — Mon, 05 May 2025 02:39:41 GMT

It's also possible, of course, that she's a fun teammate and a dependable workout partner.