US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

U2842 — Fri, 15 Sep 2023 23:22:51 GMT

See my comments below. USMS is not an inclusive organization, this was demonstrated here. I am happy to share correspondence but we all know it won't change anything.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

U2842 — Fri, 15 Sep 2023 23:21:09 GMT

You knew it was Rosh Hashanah but you went ahead with the dates anyway. Then when you had the chance to work out a compromise you doubled down and tried to ignore it. Just be honest about it.

Please don't tell us you "spoke to a Jewish friend of yours" and they didn't think it was a big deal. Not trying to shove my way of life on anyone here. I am however a member of this organization and I want to be able to participate.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

U.S. Masters Swimming — Tue, 29 Aug 2023 15:38:24 GMT

This year's USMS Sprint- and Long-Distance Open Water National Championships being held over the same dates as Rosh Hashanah is an unfortunate convergence of dates that USMS does not take lightly.

Planning swimming events, in conjunction with local hosts, venues, and communities, and USMS’s robust calendar is challenging. In fact, our annual meeting was scheduled on Sept. 8-10 (earlier than is typical), specifically to avoid the Jewish holidays in September this year. Ironically, this schedule had an impact on when these championships could be scheduled.

USMS will continue to focus on our members’ common passion for swimming and champion an inclusive and welcoming environment as we bring together adults of diverse backgrounds to enjoy the sport we love. And we’ll continue to do our best to not schedule events on important holidays whenever possible, particularly our national championship events.  

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Kurt Dickson — Sun, 27 Aug 2023 21:07:42 GMT

Just as we came to a detente and were about to join hands and sing folk songs together, predictably, the DEI committee weighs in 10 days late and 10 dollars short. Are you here to a) take accountability for the scheduling mistake b) virtue signal or c) give me the play nice in the sandbox speech?

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

swimfastatlanta — Sun, 27 Aug 2023 15:20:42 GMT

Our DEI committee is very aware of all religious holidays and has submitted a calendar to the Board every year for acknowledgement. Although I am in agreement that this is not a malicious attempt it is however poor planning and an apology statement is in order. I will bring this up to our committee at next meeting. Thank you all for your service and please be more mindful in your responses with this community feed. As mentioned we are an all inclusive organization and with that comes the responsibility of all of our members to be respectful to all members.

In gratitude ,

Leann Rossi

404-643-6063

USMS Diversity and Inclusion Commitee Member

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Elaine Krugman — Sat, 26 Aug 2023 17:57:04 GMT

Agree with Allen, Kurt, and ForceDJ. USMS is trying to be an inclusive organization.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

ForceDJ — Sat, 26 Aug 2023 11:37:50 GMT

I’ve been following this discussion, and I concur with this. As unfortunate as the situation is, I really doubt that anyone at USMS even thought “Just for spite, let’s piss off a large portion of our membership.” I would guess just the opposite happened, and there was a “How can be accommodate everyone?” consideration. But alas they weren’t able to, and something had to give in the end.

Dan

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Kurt Dickson — Fri, 25 Aug 2023 20:05:57 GMT

Agreed. It is sad but it seems our first instinct when we perceive someone has wronged us, is to assume malevolence. Sometimes it helps me to realize that it is very probable that most decisions that are made in this world were not made with me in mind (and certainly were not orchestrated to piss me off).

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Allen Stark — Fri, 25 Aug 2023 03:41:41 GMT

II love USMS andit is so much better than World Aquatis that There is no comparison. Sometimes it does things I find strange or even infuriating. I do not believe there was any malice but I think scheduling a major event on Rosh Hashanah was a mistake. At this point, I think the only thing that can be done is to acknowledge the mistake apologize and do better in the future.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

U2842 — Thu, 24 Aug 2023 02:11:09 GMT

Kurt,

Would you be ok if the USMS scheduled a National Championship meet on Christmas? I wouldn't and I'm not Christian. If we were talking about any random meet you're right, whatever. There are 52 weeks in 2023, the USMS made a conscious decision that scheduling Open Water Nats on Rosh Hashannah was a "business decision", they admitted that to me.

Let's get back to Christmas, we both know the uproar that would happen if the USMS scheduled a National Championship meet to be held on Christmas, I would be one of those folks calling for heads if they did.

We are talking about an organization is national, whose membership is diverse. We are talking about a National Championship meet. This is beyond disrespectful. This is a big FU to the Jewish community because they know they can.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Steve Newman — Mon, 21 Aug 2023 14:45:23 GMT

I agree for Mark it is a business. For me, it is pleasure. I also agree that the schedule is packed full of events and this issue should have been raised a year ago. It is unfortunate that no one had the foresight to have a calendar in front of them to have realized the possible conflict. The only place I disagree with you is the season issue. USMS changes the calendar of the season if and when they need to. I realize the changes have been few and far between. Finally, I'm glad people or groups are still submitting bids for championship events

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Kurt Dickson — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 22:37:53 GMT

Agree to some extent. Is USMS business or pleasure or is it situational? For Mark Moore, USMS is a business (I would say his very livelihood) and the lake he's running the event in, is a private lake. Is it possible those dates are the only dates he could get permission to use it? Of course, open water season is only essentially June to mid-September. Between age group, international, pro, and masters meets (not to mention a plethora of diving competitions), Mission Viejo is a very, very busy place.

I would also say that perhaps the time for dissent was a year ago when it was announced rather than a month before the event.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Steve Newman — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 21:58:03 GMT

Thank you for all your service and dedication. There is a difference between business and pleasure. You chose to be a physician and make sacrifices to help those in need. This is different. More consideration should be exercised in the decision making in this circumstance.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Kurt Dickson — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 20:04:52 GMT

I have worked as an emergency physician for 30 years. As a Christian, I am required to work my Sabbath probably 2/3 of the time. Should I insist my partners work for me despite the unfairness of the request. Perhaps I should insist the hospital close to accommodate me. Maybe I could convince people to stop getting sick on Sunday? You and your ilk are self-centered narcissists. Save your outrage; if USMS decided to have nationals on Christmas day, I would be requesting that day off 6 months in advance and selling the advantages of Christmas in Greensboro to the family.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Steve Newman — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 19:30:28 GMT

This isn't just any random holiday. This happens to be one of the most important holiday's of all. I don't care how many holidays there are across all religions, it needs to be considered and adjusted, PERIOD. What kind of an insensitive comment to say "If you can't make it, don't come. Between Christianity, Islam, and Judaism there are two dozen holidays. Counting virtual swims, there are 13 annual National Championships. Plenty of opportunities." Just because you do not care, does not mean it is okay for everyone to not care. You should be ashamed of yourself.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Elaine Krugman — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 16:53:23 GMT

Kurt will probably be SHOCKED that I actually agree with him on something, but I do agree with him on this-- only after reading his complete response. He brings up a good point: Between all of the religions, there are several religious holidays that make scheduling a challenge. And, there are a lot of other opportunities.

By the way, although I do not celebrate religious holidays, I was raised Jewish and understand how important religious holidays are to those who participate. It comes down to personal choice: Be where you need/want to be and accept you can't be both places at once.

I would hope those who celebrate Christmas and Easter would feel the same way as Kurt and I do if an event was scheduled on those holidays. (Of course, they wouldn't, though; we are in the U.S.A.!)

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

Kurt Dickson — Sun, 20 Aug 2023 16:06:21 GMT

Nope. If you can't make it, don't come. Between Christianity, Islam, and Judaism there are two dozen holidays. Counting virtual swims, there are 13 annual National Championships. Plenty of opportunities.

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

U2842 — Fri, 18 Aug 2023 17:32:49 GMT

Feel free to make your voice heard, I have reached out to the following, all can make their voices heard:

Dawson Hughes, CEO

US Masters Swimming

dhughes@usmastersswimming.org

Tom Hinchey, CEO

USA Swimming

ceo@usaswimming.org

Tina Wallen

Colorado Timing, USMS sponsor

970-222-6358

Finis Inc

USMS Sponsor

925-980-3615

Lake Mission Viejo Association (hosts of the competition)

949-770-1313

Andrew Come, Manager

The Assoc Board can be reached at x201

Brian Goodell, Mayor

Mission Viejo, CA

bgoodell@cityofmissionviejo.org

Governor Gavin Newsome, California

916-445-2841, x1,x6

govpressoffice@gov.ca.gov

Governor Ron DeSantis

850-717-9249

Congressman Jared Moscowitz

754-240-6330

Ask for Teresa Bryer

Congresswoman Debbie Wasserman Schultz

954-845-1179

Congresswoman Young Kim

40^th California representing Mission Viejo

949-268-6706

Linette Choi, District Director

Linette.choi@mail.house.gov

RE: US Masters 2023 Open Water Nationals is being held on Rosh Hashanah, does this bother anyone?

07Z48 — Fri, 18 Aug 2023 03:41:02 GMT

I am very much bothered.